I noticed a silmilarity between Romeo and Juliet and Turin and Niniel

[Beleg_Cúthalion]

The story of Turin and Niniel is quite similar to the story of Romeo and Juliet. Niniel thought Turin was dead, and that combined with the utter stress and confusion of Turin being revealed to be her brother, she takes her life. Then Turin wakes up and learns what happens, and in grief from his curse and the death of his beloved sister/wife, he does the same.

It is reversed with Romeo and Juliet. Instead, Romeo thinks that Juliet is dead when she takes a supposed poison that makes her look dead, but she wasn't. Romeo takes his own life believing she is dead, but when Juliet wakes up and finds Romeo, she weeps and does the same.

There is a similarity between the two stories, and considering that Tolkien was an English professor, it only makes sense. What do you think about that?

 

[Maedhros_Nelyafinwë]

That definitely is a very similar parallel. Tolkien would have certainly been familiar with such a famous story, but I'm not sure if he intentionally drew on it for inspiration.

I seem to remember hearing somewhere that Tolkien was inspired by the Greek myth of Oedipus (who unwittingly married his own mother and then gouged out his eyes once he realized it). I feel like I read that in a letter by Tolkien, but don't quote me on that; I don't remember exactly where I read it.

 

[Beleg_Cúthalion]

I agree. I haven't ever read a letter were he mentioned Romeo and Juliet, and he would have most certainly known that story from Shakespeare, but like you said, one can't be sure because Tolkien never wrote or said anything about it, unlike the fact that he disliked that in the story McBeth, he said no "Womanborn man" would kill McBeth, and Tolkien changed that into Eowyn's "I am no man", and Tolkien also disliked that the walking forest was just men with branches, so he made ents. So I do agree that Tolkien was very familiar with Shakespeare.

 

[Eljorahir]

Yep. Me too.

When I first read the Silmarillion many years ago I immediately thought of these similarities:

Turin falls into a death-like sleep after contacting Glaurung's blood. Juliet falls into a death-like sleep after drinking a potion.

Nienor sees Turin in his death-like sleep and... ... ... ends her own life. Romeo sees Juliet asleep thinking that she's dead and ends his own life.

After Turin wakes up and finds out Nienor is dead he ends his own life. After Juliet wakes up and sees that Romeo is dead she ends her own life.


I'm not sure, but maybe there's also some comparison to be made between Beleg and Mercutio. They're both in the role of "best friend who dies because of their relationship to their tragedy-fated friend." However, the manner of death is not quite the same.

 

[Elthir]

I seem to remember hearing somewhere that Tolkien was inspired by the Greek myth of Oedipus (who unwittingly married his own mother and then gouged out his eyes once he realized it). I feel like I read that in a letter by Tolkien, but don't quote me on that; I don't remember exactly where I read it.

Yep. In letter 131 (to Milton Waldman) Tolkien wrote:

"There is the Children of Húrin, the tragic tale of Túrin Turambar and his sister Níniel – of which Túrin is the hero: a figure that might be said (by people who like that sort of thing, though it is not very useful) to be derived from elements in Sigurd the Volsung, Oedipus, and the Finnish Kullervo."

🐾

 

[Beleg_Cúthalion]

That is a very interesting fact.

 

[Beleg_Cúthalion]

Yep. Me too.

When I first read the Silmarillion many years ago I immediately thought of these similarities:

Turin falls into a death-like sleep after contacting Glaurung's blood. Juliet falls into a death-like sleep after drinking a potion.

Nienor sees Turin in his death-like sleep and... ... ... ends her own life. Romeo sees Juliet asleep thinking that she's dead and ends his own life.

After Turin wakes up and finds out Nienor is dead he ends his own life. After Juliet wakes up and sees that Romeo is dead she ends her own life.


I'm not sure, but maybe there's also some comparison to be made between Beleg and Mercutio. They're both in the role of "best friend who dies because of their relationship to their tragedy-fated friend." However, the manner of death is not quite the same.

I certaintly agree with that.

 

[Elthir]

As Cabed-en-Aras is Sindarin for "Leap of the Deer", it doesn't take a great leap of imagination to see a correlation between deer and soldier.

But let's not jump to any conclusions here, or spring into action too soon, in case there are unforeseen hurdles yet to consider.

sorry

 

[Elthir]

Sure, I tend to think out loud before researching.

Oh, sorry again. My post above was just to try my hand at some "leap" puns.

I guess I should have kept them in the vault.

sorry again again