Who is the oldest?

[Ariana Undomiel]

Ok, I haven't been on here for several months so I need some time to catch on to what all has been happening around here.

Lately I have been listening to the entire Lord of the Rings books read on CD and having had the chance to hear them again and again I have begun to pick up some interesting thoughts.

I think either there is an error in the books or I am simply very confused.

Tom Bombadil said that he was the oldest thing in Middle Earth but Gandalf said that Treebeard was even though Treebeard said he wasn't. I will have to look up the quotes but I think there is a conflict going on. So excluding the elves who were not born in Middle Earth, who is the oldest creature in ME?

- Ariana

 

[BlackCaptain]

It's been discussed before, and Tom is just as old as anyone... Cuz he's just Tom. Treebeard is the oldest thing in Middle Earth yes, but that's aside from the Maiar like Gandalf, Sauron and all them. But Tom is unclassified, and we can't really tell how old he is. He IS older than treebeard... because he was there when everyone came. Perhaps Tom isn't living... I really don't know.

This very question you ask is inanswerable i believe

 

[Ariana Undomiel]

Ok, that would explain Tom, but Treebeard says himself that there were things in Middle Earth before him. I will have to look up the quote to make sure.

- Ariana

 

[Beorn]

http://thetolkien.forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=10107
http://thetolkien.forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=3926

 

[BlackCaptain]

Also, from the Letters of JRR Tolkien, Tolkien says that Treebeard was just a character from Tolkien's books, fully capable of errors and mistakes.

 

[Flammifer]

There's not much use asking this question I'm afraid. There simply isn't an answer to this one IMO. It is possible to say that Treebeard isn't as old as Tom, but nothing more.

 

[Inderjit S]

Bombadil seems to have been in Arda from the start the Ents seem to be the first race that entered Arda, Treebeard was the oldest of the 'Ents' as a race, whislt Tom was a individual a intentional enigma.

Even some whole inventions like the remarkable Ents, oldest of all living rational creatures

Letter 131; Letters of Tolkien

Ents the most ancient people surviving in the Third Age

Appendix F

When the children awake, then the thought of Yavanna should awake too, and it will summon spirits from afar and they will go among the kelvar and olvar

Of Ents and Eagles; HoME 11

We also find in the Treason of Isengard[/I (HoME 7) that the chapter Treebeard was mainyl written 'written itslef' that it had no basis, Tolkien just wrote and followed his train of thoughts.

Also, from the Letters of JRR Tolkien, Tolkien says that Treebeard was just a character from Tolkien's books, fully capable of errors and mistakes

That was a reference to his thoughts on the origins of Orks and Trolls. He is called 'eldest' or reffered to as being the eldest creature by others, such as Gandalf and Celeborn.

 

[Celebthôl]

Tom B was older

 

[Beleg]

Bombadil, the oldest Enigma, Ents the Oldest race, Elves the first speaking race.

 

[BlackCaptain]

Originally posted by Celebthôl
Tom B was older

I think... that Tom B is. Not was. *insert other metaphorical ramblings on past and present here*

 

[Celebthôl]

Zacly that BC my mistake