Why did Denethor give up when Sam still was willing to go?

[BalrogRingDestroyer]

There actually is quite a parallel, and the two times may well have been close to each other too, though, admittedly, Denethor lost Boromir and seemed likely to lose Faramir, as well as himself in the battle, but, otherwise, things looked the same, or, indeed, probably BLEAKER for Sam, as if he failed, it was certainly game over, as Sauron would get the Ring.

Denethor sees Faramir near death and thinks it's over and tries to kill himself and Faramir.

Smawise sees Frodo seemingly dead and yet is willing to try and take the quest on alone, with practically no hope of succeeding, believing it possible that the other members of the quest may be dead or about to die.

How is it that a lowly gardener Hobbit had more courage and will to try and go on than the High Steward of Gondor of the line of Numenor?

 

[Starbrow]

I think some of it has to do with pride. Denethor had too much pride in himself and his abilities. When he believed that everything he cared about would be destroyed, he couldn't face it and sought to end it all. Whereas, Sam was humble and didn't believe he had any power. He just tried to do his best in what way he could. And even at that point in the story he still had some hope, unbelievable as it may be.

 

[Deimos]

I think some of it has to do with pride. Denethor had too much pride in himself and his abilities. When he believed that everything he cared about would be destroyed, he couldn't face it and sought to end it all. Whereas, Sam was humble and didn't believe he had any power. He just tried to do his best in what way he could. And even at that point in the story he still had some hope, unbelievable as it may be.

Yep... ^^ this is it, exactly^^...
Denethor could not bear loss of face.
Sam knew his limitations and, for want of a kinder way of saying it, Sam had no "face" to lose, so there was nothing inhibiting him from acting rightly.

Remember Janis Joplin: "Freedom's just another word for nothing left to lose. "

 

[Eljorahir]

Also, Sam was not a direct target of mental coercion from Sauron like Denethor was.

 

[Aldarion]

There actually is quite a parallel, and the two times may well have been close to each other too, though, admittedly, Denethor lost Boromir and seemed likely to lose Faramir, as well as himself in the battle, but, otherwise, things looked the same, or, indeed, probably BLEAKER for Sam, as if he failed, it was certainly game over, as Sauron would get the Ring.

Denethor sees Faramir near death and thinks it's over and tries to kill himself and Faramir.

Smawise sees Frodo seemingly dead and yet is willing to try and take the quest on alone, with practically no hope of succeeding, believing it possible that the other members of the quest may be dead or about to die.

How is it that a lowly gardener Hobbit had more courage and will to try and go on than the High Steward of Gondor of the line of Numenor?

Because Sam still had hope, and something to live for. Yes, he believed Frodo had died - but he still believed in their task, their quest, and that if he manages to get to the Orodruin and destroy the One Ring, he will be able to save everyone else he cared about.

Denethor, having no faith in success of the Fellowship and well aware of how strong Sauron was, believed that he, his family, his people - everything he cared about - were inevitably doomed to being enslaved by Sauron. He was still willing to try and resist however - but he apparently had nothing left to live for but Faramir and Gondor, and with Faramir apparently dying and the City seemingly about to fall, he saw absolutely no hope in salvation nor any possibility of a miracle. And he also did not have that "northern courage" that moved Theoden and later Eomer to, in seemingly likewise hopeless situation, choose glorious death in battle.

 

[Deimos]

Also, Sam was not a direct target of mental coercion from Sauron like Denethor was.

Excellent point 👍... I totally spaced on that.🙄

 

[Deimos]

Also, Sam was not a direct target of mental coercion from Sauron like Denethor was.

I would only quibble with "coercion" which is very close to being forced or compelled to do something.
Denethor had a mighty will and I don't see him being forced to do anything.
I would say that it was more Sauron "wearing down" Denethor's will to the point that Denethor willingly threw in the towel, that he despaired.

 

[Eljorahir]

I would only quibble with "coercion" which is very close to being forced or compelled to do something.
Denethor had a mighty will and I don't see him being forced to do anything.
I would say that it was more Sauron "wearing down" Denethor's will to the point that Denethor willingly threw in the towel, that he despaired.

Yes, good point. Maybe "psychological manipulation" or "conditioning" may be more accurate.

 

[Deimos]

Yes, good point. Maybe "psychological manipulation" or "conditioning" may be more accurate.

'Zactly.
Denethor's situation would not be tragic if he were compelled to do what he did.
He is (imo) not entirely responsible for his actions because anyone who despairs is not quite sane (normal) for the reasons' you stated (in this case) .
However, he is fully responsible for his own character which lead him to that tragic end.

"Sow a thought and you reap an action; sow an action and you reap a habit; sow a habit and you reap a character; sow a character and you reap a destiny. " --Emerson

Both Boromir and Faramir had iron wills similar to their father's.
But their individual characters developed differently; Boromir more nearly like his father, Faramir less so, because the blood of Westernesse (Numenor) flowed more truly in him.
It is why Boromir is also a tragic figure.

​

 

[Trackz]

There actually is quite a parallel, and the two times may well have been close to each other too, though, admittedly, Denethor lost Boromir and seemed likely to lose Faramir, as well as himself in the battle, but, otherwise, things looked the same, or, indeed, probably BLEAKER for Sam, as if he failed, it was certainly game over, as Sauron would get the Ring.

Denethor sees Faramir near death and thinks it's over and tries to kill himself and Faramir.

Smawise sees Frodo seemingly dead and yet is willing to try and take the quest on alone, with practically no hope of succeeding, believing it possible that the other members of the quest may be dead or about to die.

How is it that a lowly gardener Hobbit had more courage and will to try and go on than the High Steward of Gondor of the line of Numenor?

“My dear Frodo!’ exclaimed Gandalf. ‘Hobbits really are amazing creatures, as I have said before. You can learn all that there is to know about their ways in a month, and yet after a hundred years they can still surprise you at a pinch.”​

― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Fellowship of the Ring

 

[Idril Celebrindal]

There actually is quite a parallel, and the two times may well have been close to each other too, though, admittedly, Denethor lost Boromir and seemed likely to lose Faramir, as well as himself in the battle, but, otherwise, things looked the same, or, indeed, probably BLEAKER for Sam, as if he failed, it was certainly game over, as Sauron would get the Ring.

Denethor sees Faramir near death and thinks it's over and tries to kill himself and Faramir.

Smawise sees Frodo seemingly dead and yet is willing to try and take the quest on alone, with practically no hope of succeeding, believing it possible that the other members of the quest may be dead or about to die.

How is it that a lowly gardener Hobbit had more courage and will to try and go on than the High Steward of Gondor of the line of Numenor?

It's because Sam had wonderful golden potatoes to look forward to, but all Denethor had were cherry tomatoes.