Þráinn Þórhallsson
Member
- Joined
- Jul 10, 2019
- Messages
- 173
I made this thread for anybody to rate their favorite to least favorite Tolkien high fantasy fairy tale. Either way having read all of them say for the unfinished tales(which I have no interest in reading). I have decided to rank all 6 of them. Please, note tho that I am not counting the Lord of the Rings appendix as their separated stories as they are included in the last book in the series. I will also count all the Lord of the Rings books as one story as that is how Tolkien always intended them to be read.
Nr 1: The Hobbit.
Not just my favorite Tolkien Middle Earth story but just my favorite story in general. First of all Bilbo is probably the best character in all of Tolkien's books. How he develops from a ''stuck in routine'' typical Hobbit who dislikes adventures because people on adventures are never in time for tea and falls flat on the floor by the mare thought of dying in an adventures, to starving in Mirkwood and risking his life just to escape Gollum's death grip without killing him is the best character arc in any book I have ever read.
Also, this is the story were I honestly find Sauron to be the most intimidating. Sure he is not the main bad guy or even the second main bad guy, but the fact that they face Goblins, Wargs giant Spiders and a fire breathing Dragon and yet the Necromancer as he was called then is the only one who Gandalf says is out of the question for them to pass by is so more terrifying then anything he does in the Lord of the Rings and the fact that the last thing that Gandalf tells Bilbo and the Dwarfs before they head into Mirkwood is to not pass by the Necromancer is quite foreboding given the horrors of Mirkwood.
Other than that I guess I should mention that Thorin is in many ways the first example that I knew of a, of a morally gray if not an outright antihero in Tolkien's books. Please note that if the army of Goblins, Wargs and evil bats had not come to steal the treasure in the end, he would have attacked the lake town people wholesale just to get the Arkenstone back. He may not be Mim, but he is most certainly a darker member of the supporting cast than say Boromir. Speaking of which
Nr 2: The Children of Húrin.
So given my fondness for the Hobbit I think it is quite appropriate that my second favorite book is like a dark adult version of said story. I mean when you really think about it next to Bilbo Túrin Turumbar is probably the one character who goes through the most changes in any of Tolkien's middle earth stories. It should be said tho that while most people will note the tragedy of Túrin's and Niënor relationship I always find him killing Brandir to be at the top of his tragedy. The limp man who Túrin gave his most priced possession to out of pity when all the elf seemed resent him for his clumsines makes it hit so much harder when Túrin kills him simply for telling him the truth. It is also fitting irony that he would have been his first friend as much like how Brandir's biggest blunder is to accidentally hitting his leg with an ax and one of Túrin's first and biggest mistakes was accidentally stabbing a man to death.
Also, Glaurung the father of all dragons is in many ways the darker more effective version of Smaug from the Hobbit and Mim is like the even more petty and evil version of Thorin and in this book Morgoth is like a even more terrifying version of the Necromancer in this book. Anyway Gurthang is probably the most memorable weapon in all of Tolkien's stories. I honestly find a fantasy sword being black to be much more befitting of a weapon then being a glowing shinning beacon of light like Sting and Glamdring. Yeah, sword can be a useful tool to get rid of the Orc pest, but in the end to take a life is a big decision and not one to be taking lightly. Basically Túrin is closer the man who Sam Wise and Bilbo would have been if they had, had more resentment towards Gollum than compassion. Because in the end story of Túrin Turumbar is not the story of the ideal Christian hero who's priorities is spare and save life's rather than taking them but the the mercyless heroes of the old Europe like Odyssey or perhaps more appropriately giving that I am discussing Túrin Oedipus. However the greatest glory of those old heroes was to die in battle and Túrin Turumbar dies in shame by his own sword just like how the sentient sword is broken in Túrin's suicide.
I know that is considered quite shallow to praise a work for being the darkest, but there is something to be said about a work were the triumph of evil seems unavoidable and were princess and princesses are cursed by the devil as opposed to have the blessings of God.
Nr 3: The Lord of the Rings.
When ever I think of this story the trio of Sam, Frodo and Smeagol always come to mind as they examplify the main theme of this story which is the power if mercy. Before the Lord of the Rings Tolkien rewrote the chapter were Bilbo meets Gollum and reworks their first encounter to be that of a lost soul being spared dead do to the mercy of a better Hobbit leading said hobbit to spare him, then the whole lord of the rings is pretty much a expansion of this one chapter. Both Frodo and Sam desire to kill the disgusting Gollum. Frodo tells Gandalf that Gollum was worthy of death and Gandalf agrees but Frodo later changes his tune when he finally sees Gollum clearly for himself while Sam wants him dead. Then when either Frodo has had enough of Gollum and giving him chances and or because of the evil influences of the one ring he let's Sam do as he wants with sneaky murderer only for Sam feeling the same compassion for Gollum as Bilbo and Frodo before him and let's Gollum go which in the end the way the Hobbits are accidentally succeed in their mission to have the one ring destroyed.
On the other hand being mercy less is almost like a metric of how evil their opponents are. Sarúman treats Wormtongue like a useful but disposable tool which he does not hesitate to throw under the chariot so to speak when ever he can. In the end tho Gandalfs suggestion to, Theoden to spare Wormtongue and Sarúman disrespectful treatment of his closest henchman is in the end what leads to Pippin being able to create a distraction for the main bad guy Sauron and ends with the ultimate downfall of Sarúman as he is literally stabbed in the back by is pathetic henchman after insulting him for always doing Sarúman's biddings. Like wise Saruon is shown as a an exceptionally cruel master of his subjects. Feeding them to Shelob and forcing them to do his bidding when the Orcs would much rather be out hunting out in the wild. Like wise it is speculated by Sam Wise that many of the Haradrims are forced to partake in the takeover of middle earth by their leaders even if they might have much rather want to be living in the comfort of their homes if they had been given the choice to do so.
The other big theme of this story however would be how all evil desires power. The nine men who got the rings were the one's corrupted because men above all else desire power and that leads them to become slaves to the dark lord. Pathetically sneaking around for the ring on their masters behest like a dog trying to sniff up his masters possession. Like wise the respectful wizard Sarúman ends like nothing more than the leader of a bunch of half-orcs in the raiding against a defenseless Shire because of thirst for the power that the one ring could have brought him. The Mouth of Sauron is said to be more evil than any Orc despite him being Númenorian(basically the closest anybody can be to Eru's favorite people the Elfs) and the only other thing we know about him is that Sauron has promised him the be the next ruler of Isengard(or at least that is strongly suggested). Then of course their is Sauron himself who is so enamored with power that he has little worry that anybody would willingly destroy the one ring that it ultimately leads to his doom.
In the end the Lord of the Rings is a thematically strong story and without getting to socio-political probably the most Christian story that Tolkien ever wrote.
Nr 4: Beren and Lúthien
If the Hobbit is the children's adventure and Children of Húrin is the tragedy then Beren and Lúthien is the love story. I will say tho compared to the other two as well as the Lord of the Rings this one is more of a classic fairy tale. Their are no massive battle just a man doing on an adventure to earn the love of his life completing the task set forth for him to do so that way the story of Beren and Lúthien is more like those classic fairytale like the Long Footed Giant and Eagle Eye, than Tolkiens usual war epics. of course their is the twist of Lúthien ultimately being one to save Beren and in that way Tolkien might be the first writer to subvert the classic fairy tale trope of the knight saving the princess. Oh, and I guess as an Icelandic person I should appreciate the refference to Snorra-Edda when Carcharoth sealing his demise by biting Berens hand of.
Finally I will say that I appreciate that Tolkien does give both Lúthien and Sauron the visage of a bat at one point. One thing annoying about Tolkiens work for me is how natural phenomenons are aften presented as being either inherently evil or inherently good. Here tho the wings of the bat are both the wings of Sauron our main antagonist and Lúthien our main heroine, unlike say old church paintings were all angels have bird wings while the demons have bat wings.
Nr. 5: The Silmarillion
Not the biggest fan of this one mostly because it is centered around the main bad guy of the book Morgoth and he is not even my favorite of Tolkien's bad guys as that would be Sauron. I guess the closest we have to a main protaganist is Eru Ilúvatar or Fingolfim and I will say the battle between Fingolfim and Morgoth is pretty much the highlight of the story. However given that the Orcs in Lord of the Rings are said to hate their master it is a bit strange that they would grief for Melkor after he receives the foot wound from Fingolfim. Speaking of Orc's, the story of their creation is probably the most interesting origin story of them all in this book. I know that Tolkien did not much care for it and had he made a third version of the Silmarillion he would have changed the Orc's origin from being corrupted Elves originally to being corrupted men. Personally I find the Orc's origin in the official version much better. Why? Well, aside from the fact that Morgoth is making his own people out of Eru's favorite beings. please take into account that Elves are the most sensitive of all beings in middle earth. Both Arwen and Lúthien(and yes I know she is admittedly only a half-elf) die of sadness when their men fall victims to their own mortality. Also, without getting to adult I will also mention that Elf's can not survive being violated as it is enough to break their weak hearts. Now Morgoth with out a doubt used some black magic to turn Elves into Goblins but it is also made clear that he tortured the elves in Ulmo in order to turn them into Orc's. Now if losing a loved one or being violated is enough to kill an Elf it is therefor fitting that the Elfs would also be the only creature in Middle Earth emotional enough to carry their emotional damage to the next generation therefor being a prime target for the creation of an eternally miserable and spiteful creature like the Orc.
Nr. 6: The Fall of Gondolin
I have to admit this one is pretty boring and honestly the only real highlight of the story is the actual fall of the city and the battle between Glorfindel and the Balrong and even then after reading the Lord of the Rings said battle comes of as a pale imitation of a stand of I much rather read about.
Anyway if you disagree with my ranking or want to add the unfinished tales to yours, you are more than welcome to do so. After all that is why I made this thread.
Nr 1: The Hobbit.
Not just my favorite Tolkien Middle Earth story but just my favorite story in general. First of all Bilbo is probably the best character in all of Tolkien's books. How he develops from a ''stuck in routine'' typical Hobbit who dislikes adventures because people on adventures are never in time for tea and falls flat on the floor by the mare thought of dying in an adventures, to starving in Mirkwood and risking his life just to escape Gollum's death grip without killing him is the best character arc in any book I have ever read.
Also, this is the story were I honestly find Sauron to be the most intimidating. Sure he is not the main bad guy or even the second main bad guy, but the fact that they face Goblins, Wargs giant Spiders and a fire breathing Dragon and yet the Necromancer as he was called then is the only one who Gandalf says is out of the question for them to pass by is so more terrifying then anything he does in the Lord of the Rings and the fact that the last thing that Gandalf tells Bilbo and the Dwarfs before they head into Mirkwood is to not pass by the Necromancer is quite foreboding given the horrors of Mirkwood.
Other than that I guess I should mention that Thorin is in many ways the first example that I knew of a, of a morally gray if not an outright antihero in Tolkien's books. Please note that if the army of Goblins, Wargs and evil bats had not come to steal the treasure in the end, he would have attacked the lake town people wholesale just to get the Arkenstone back. He may not be Mim, but he is most certainly a darker member of the supporting cast than say Boromir. Speaking of which
Nr 2: The Children of Húrin.
So given my fondness for the Hobbit I think it is quite appropriate that my second favorite book is like a dark adult version of said story. I mean when you really think about it next to Bilbo Túrin Turumbar is probably the one character who goes through the most changes in any of Tolkien's middle earth stories. It should be said tho that while most people will note the tragedy of Túrin's and Niënor relationship I always find him killing Brandir to be at the top of his tragedy. The limp man who Túrin gave his most priced possession to out of pity when all the elf seemed resent him for his clumsines makes it hit so much harder when Túrin kills him simply for telling him the truth. It is also fitting irony that he would have been his first friend as much like how Brandir's biggest blunder is to accidentally hitting his leg with an ax and one of Túrin's first and biggest mistakes was accidentally stabbing a man to death.
Also, Glaurung the father of all dragons is in many ways the darker more effective version of Smaug from the Hobbit and Mim is like the even more petty and evil version of Thorin and in this book Morgoth is like a even more terrifying version of the Necromancer in this book. Anyway Gurthang is probably the most memorable weapon in all of Tolkien's stories. I honestly find a fantasy sword being black to be much more befitting of a weapon then being a glowing shinning beacon of light like Sting and Glamdring. Yeah, sword can be a useful tool to get rid of the Orc pest, but in the end to take a life is a big decision and not one to be taking lightly. Basically Túrin is closer the man who Sam Wise and Bilbo would have been if they had, had more resentment towards Gollum than compassion. Because in the end story of Túrin Turumbar is not the story of the ideal Christian hero who's priorities is spare and save life's rather than taking them but the the mercyless heroes of the old Europe like Odyssey or perhaps more appropriately giving that I am discussing Túrin Oedipus. However the greatest glory of those old heroes was to die in battle and Túrin Turumbar dies in shame by his own sword just like how the sentient sword is broken in Túrin's suicide.
I know that is considered quite shallow to praise a work for being the darkest, but there is something to be said about a work were the triumph of evil seems unavoidable and were princess and princesses are cursed by the devil as opposed to have the blessings of God.
Nr 3: The Lord of the Rings.
When ever I think of this story the trio of Sam, Frodo and Smeagol always come to mind as they examplify the main theme of this story which is the power if mercy. Before the Lord of the Rings Tolkien rewrote the chapter were Bilbo meets Gollum and reworks their first encounter to be that of a lost soul being spared dead do to the mercy of a better Hobbit leading said hobbit to spare him, then the whole lord of the rings is pretty much a expansion of this one chapter. Both Frodo and Sam desire to kill the disgusting Gollum. Frodo tells Gandalf that Gollum was worthy of death and Gandalf agrees but Frodo later changes his tune when he finally sees Gollum clearly for himself while Sam wants him dead. Then when either Frodo has had enough of Gollum and giving him chances and or because of the evil influences of the one ring he let's Sam do as he wants with sneaky murderer only for Sam feeling the same compassion for Gollum as Bilbo and Frodo before him and let's Gollum go which in the end the way the Hobbits are accidentally succeed in their mission to have the one ring destroyed.
On the other hand being mercy less is almost like a metric of how evil their opponents are. Sarúman treats Wormtongue like a useful but disposable tool which he does not hesitate to throw under the chariot so to speak when ever he can. In the end tho Gandalfs suggestion to, Theoden to spare Wormtongue and Sarúman disrespectful treatment of his closest henchman is in the end what leads to Pippin being able to create a distraction for the main bad guy Sauron and ends with the ultimate downfall of Sarúman as he is literally stabbed in the back by is pathetic henchman after insulting him for always doing Sarúman's biddings. Like wise Saruon is shown as a an exceptionally cruel master of his subjects. Feeding them to Shelob and forcing them to do his bidding when the Orcs would much rather be out hunting out in the wild. Like wise it is speculated by Sam Wise that many of the Haradrims are forced to partake in the takeover of middle earth by their leaders even if they might have much rather want to be living in the comfort of their homes if they had been given the choice to do so.
The other big theme of this story however would be how all evil desires power. The nine men who got the rings were the one's corrupted because men above all else desire power and that leads them to become slaves to the dark lord. Pathetically sneaking around for the ring on their masters behest like a dog trying to sniff up his masters possession. Like wise the respectful wizard Sarúman ends like nothing more than the leader of a bunch of half-orcs in the raiding against a defenseless Shire because of thirst for the power that the one ring could have brought him. The Mouth of Sauron is said to be more evil than any Orc despite him being Númenorian(basically the closest anybody can be to Eru's favorite people the Elfs) and the only other thing we know about him is that Sauron has promised him the be the next ruler of Isengard(or at least that is strongly suggested). Then of course their is Sauron himself who is so enamored with power that he has little worry that anybody would willingly destroy the one ring that it ultimately leads to his doom.
In the end the Lord of the Rings is a thematically strong story and without getting to socio-political probably the most Christian story that Tolkien ever wrote.
Nr 4: Beren and Lúthien
If the Hobbit is the children's adventure and Children of Húrin is the tragedy then Beren and Lúthien is the love story. I will say tho compared to the other two as well as the Lord of the Rings this one is more of a classic fairy tale. Their are no massive battle just a man doing on an adventure to earn the love of his life completing the task set forth for him to do so that way the story of Beren and Lúthien is more like those classic fairytale like the Long Footed Giant and Eagle Eye, than Tolkiens usual war epics. of course their is the twist of Lúthien ultimately being one to save Beren and in that way Tolkien might be the first writer to subvert the classic fairy tale trope of the knight saving the princess. Oh, and I guess as an Icelandic person I should appreciate the refference to Snorra-Edda when Carcharoth sealing his demise by biting Berens hand of.
Finally I will say that I appreciate that Tolkien does give both Lúthien and Sauron the visage of a bat at one point. One thing annoying about Tolkiens work for me is how natural phenomenons are aften presented as being either inherently evil or inherently good. Here tho the wings of the bat are both the wings of Sauron our main antagonist and Lúthien our main heroine, unlike say old church paintings were all angels have bird wings while the demons have bat wings.
Nr. 5: The Silmarillion
Not the biggest fan of this one mostly because it is centered around the main bad guy of the book Morgoth and he is not even my favorite of Tolkien's bad guys as that would be Sauron. I guess the closest we have to a main protaganist is Eru Ilúvatar or Fingolfim and I will say the battle between Fingolfim and Morgoth is pretty much the highlight of the story. However given that the Orcs in Lord of the Rings are said to hate their master it is a bit strange that they would grief for Melkor after he receives the foot wound from Fingolfim. Speaking of Orc's, the story of their creation is probably the most interesting origin story of them all in this book. I know that Tolkien did not much care for it and had he made a third version of the Silmarillion he would have changed the Orc's origin from being corrupted Elves originally to being corrupted men. Personally I find the Orc's origin in the official version much better. Why? Well, aside from the fact that Morgoth is making his own people out of Eru's favorite beings. please take into account that Elves are the most sensitive of all beings in middle earth. Both Arwen and Lúthien(and yes I know she is admittedly only a half-elf) die of sadness when their men fall victims to their own mortality. Also, without getting to adult I will also mention that Elf's can not survive being violated as it is enough to break their weak hearts. Now Morgoth with out a doubt used some black magic to turn Elves into Goblins but it is also made clear that he tortured the elves in Ulmo in order to turn them into Orc's. Now if losing a loved one or being violated is enough to kill an Elf it is therefor fitting that the Elfs would also be the only creature in Middle Earth emotional enough to carry their emotional damage to the next generation therefor being a prime target for the creation of an eternally miserable and spiteful creature like the Orc.
Nr. 6: The Fall of Gondolin
I have to admit this one is pretty boring and honestly the only real highlight of the story is the actual fall of the city and the battle between Glorfindel and the Balrong and even then after reading the Lord of the Rings said battle comes of as a pale imitation of a stand of I much rather read about.
Anyway if you disagree with my ranking or want to add the unfinished tales to yours, you are more than welcome to do so. After all that is why I made this thread.
Last edited:
