Aragorn's Weapon

Harad · Feb 18, 2002

well I agree its "not much use", however why would Elrond give it to Aragorn at age 20

Aragorn was in an unusual position compared with his forefathers in that his father was killed when he was 2 and he was raised by Elrond. Therefore getting it at age 20, was just part of his heritage being revealed, but unlikely to be for use as a weapon.

1. how many scabbards, how many swords per scabbard? In the absence of another weapon of not--axe, spear, etc. the weapon of choice for a fighting man has to be a sword

2. why take Narsil from Rivendell to get it reforged, when it was going to be reforged at Rivendell.

3. I think enuf time has gone by to say that if Aragorn had another weapon, and he probably did, it is never mentioned, except perhaps the hunting bow.

daisy · Feb 18, 2002

But you said he had a french tickler!!

I still assume a dagger played a part somewhere - a scabbard can be many things but I assume it was a thin covering made out of leather where the sword would be placed - if the sword is sharp it would not make sense to have it dangling around your thigh!!

Ashaman would know about scabbards, or Cirayher.

Harad · Feb 18, 2002

Absolutely needs a scabbard, even for a FT. But if Narsil is in it, there is no room for a full sword. So he needs a second scabbard.

Also no one answered why Merry's sword was effective against the Witch Lord, but Narsil would not be--both swords of Numenor with Narsil being a bit more so.

Eonwe · Feb 18, 2002

Originally posted by Harad

Aragorn was in an unusual position compared with his forefathers in that his father was killed when he was 2 and he was raised by Elrond. Therefore getting it at age 20, was just part of his heritage being revealed, but unlikely to be for use as a weapon.

IYO? unlikely ok, fine, but no evidence of any other weapon.

1. how many scabbards, how many swords per scabbard? In the absence of another weapon of not--axe, spear, etc. the weapon of choice for a fighting man has to be a sword

Well, as I have shown above, Isildur had a "short sword" in his "belt" along with a "sheath" with Narsil, the sheath he gave to Ohtar.

2. why take Narsil from Rivendell to get it reforged, when it was going to be reforged at Rivendell.

only to use it as a weapon Did he come from Rivendell and then back to Rivendell? don't think so.

3. I think enuf time has gone by to say that if Aragorn had another weapon, and he probably did, it is never mentioned, except perhaps the hunting bow.

xactly...

Harad · Feb 18, 2002

Well, as I have shown above, Isildur had a "short sword" in his "belt" along with a "sheath" with Narsil, the sheath he gave to Ohtar.

This is a good plausibility argument for another weapon. However, neither a short sword nor a dagger is a serious weapon for a Major League Warrior. Like giving Barry Bonds a 20 oz bat.

Eonwe · Feb 18, 2002

its the only sad quote I got

20oz bat for Bonds -- bet Hank Aaron could do better with Narsil.

daisy · Feb 18, 2002

Who said Narsil couldn't kick some Nazgul butt? I think the point is the odds:
Merry vs. Nazgul Lord

Aragorn vs. Nazgul Lorde plus eight other creepos.

Only has one Narsil, two hands, you know?
And they have those nasty witch blades.

Sometimes warriors wore a sword strapped over their shoulder in a sort-of shoulder/back scabbard a la Conan.This would allow for a second scabbard without doing a double thigh deal - hard to sit down ...also doesn't help with the left hand /right hand thing...Aragorn was a lefty or we don't know?? Could he have necessarily fight equally well with both hands??

He's also very good at using found objects and enemies weapons against them - like bask an orc with a shield and take his sword... are orcs male?

HLGStrider · Feb 18, 2002

One would assume they were...

I still think there was a bit of an emotional attachment to the thing and he did hope to use it as identification and wasn't planning to fight. Perhaps it was a last, youthful bit of idocy, when hope sprang anew in his heart that he was about to win. Might as well grab that old sword.

Grond · Feb 18, 2002

Just a mild interjection of fact. Narsil was forged by Telchar the Dwarf in the First Age and since the Witch-king wasn't alive then, it is doubtful any spells were laid upon it that would directly affect him. Merry's blade, on the other hand, was forged when the Witch-king was the main foe of Arnor and, according to the book, spells were laid on it that were specific to the Witch-king.

I haven't looked up the quotes but will if anyone wishes. They are there.

Harad · Feb 18, 2002

Facts are an unwelcome interjection, but that one I will accept. Merry's knife may have been more effective against the Witch King than Narsil.
(Still Narsil did great harm to the Witch King's boss remember.) If Narsil is less useful, even more reason to have another weapon.

Aragorn could have have had any number of weapons in any number of places--his back, his boots, his sleeves--they just arent mentioned by JRRT.

Aragorn wouldnt have taken a trip across the dangerous North with a useless weapon for "sentimental" reasons. And 87 year old Aragorn's "youthful bit of idiocy"? C'mon!

Beleg Strongbow · Feb 19, 2002

Originally posted by Harad
Facts are an unwelcome interjection, but that one I will accept. Merry's knife may have been more effective against the Witch King than Narsil.
(Still Narsil did great harm to the Witch King's boss remember.) If Narsil is less useful, even more reason to have another weapon.

Aragorn could have have had any number of weapons in any number of places--his back, his boots, his sleeves--they just arent mentioned by JRRT.

Aragorn wouldnt have taken a trip across the dangerous North with a useless weapon for "sentimental" reasons. And 87 year old Aragorn's "youthful bit of idiocy"? C'mon!

Yes he could have had it anywhere and tolkien didn't say if he did or didn't so who knows but commensense say's yes.

Snaga · Feb 19, 2002

It sounds sensible that he should be armed, but if so it must have been a concealed weapon. It beggars belief that he would openly carry a weapon and JRRT not describe it. Think of the context: Sam's deep suspicion until the meeting with Glorfindel - he wouldn't have like it.

But equally, I don't see Bree-land as a particularly hostile territory. Indeed, I'd suggest that from Barlimans reaction to the heavily armed hobbits returning home you can infer that people rarely wandered around with significant amounts of weaponry. What about the road east to Rivendell? They meet no danger apart from the 9, so perhaps suggesting that Aragorn expects to do the trip unarmed initially is no so unreasonable.

Harad · Feb 19, 2002

And where would he keep his arms while traveling unarmed? Back in Rivendell? On Weathertop? Conveniently in a barrow?

Snaga · Feb 19, 2002

At Fornost or Rivendell makes some sense. Who knows? I'm sure that JRRT could write something in as required. Maybe Auntie Pacer lived at Archet?

Harad · Feb 19, 2002

I dont think you will find an adventure, fantasy, dungeons and dragons, etc. story, where a main fighting character, puts down his arms in the middle because he feels some multi-day journey is "safe." Even if there werent "fell beasts" within one-days march of Bree, there are still dangerous wild (not evil) animals. Why would Aragorn limit himself to a one-foot hilt shard for protection? He is traveling alone in a semi-wilderness. There are no call boxes.

For whatever reason (not for ID purposes) he has filled his one and only scabbard with the hilt-shard. I hope he has his bow with him, and I hope he doesnt have to engage in close-in combat with a determined foe or foes.

HLGStrider · Feb 19, 2002

Perhaps Tolkien didn't write it in, but I'm sure if he were alive, he would not rewrite the book to include another weapon or take out Narsil. He would write a story, essay, or explanation explaining the move. He wasn't the type of person to see this so much as a problem as an opportunity... At least not from the Carpenter Biography...

Let's all assume he carried a weapon of some sort. A knife.. or maybe he was good at quarter staffing and excepted the tree branch as a good subsitute.

He seemed to like using the brands against the riders... and gee did it look good on film with all those bright swirling... off subject I know... I know...

Harad · Feb 19, 2002

Here's a "lifted" opinion on this subject from somebody who might elicit applause and hisses:

http://www.thescriptanalyst.com/

"The Aragorn-King thing is something that we definitely have manipulated and pushed and shoved in a different way to the books,” Jackson admits. “A few people have mentioned they’re disappointed that in Brie [my guess is the interviewer stuck in the 'cheese' and not the town--Harad] you don’t see Strider pull out the broken sword. I deliberately didn’t go there, ecause I couldn’t imagine that happening without getting a laugh from people that have never read the books. You’ve got your hero. You’ve got Viggo [Mortensen] with his big [scabbard], and he pulls out a sword—and it’s broke off! It’s very difficult to shut your eyes and actually imagine that happening in a way that the uninitiated won’t say, ‘What the hell’s that?’ So we were just a little scared about that, to be completely honest.

HLGStrider · Feb 19, 2002

Harad, totally personal, but... don't you sleep??? You are the quickest replier I could think of... Of course, I'm a tad bit amateur at this...

HLGStrider · Feb 19, 2002

More seriously... and by the way, when I look back at that, that looked mean, Harad, but it was meant more as a compliment for speedy response... No derogotory intent...

Anyway, your comment about no call boxes could also go with my theory (Or whoever owns it... intellectual property... someone ought to copywrite...) that Aragorn was stuck with no way to contact his rangers and get a weapon...

As for my "youthful idocy" comment... No comment that I misspelt idocy... I hate looking things up... don't you think finding himself so much closer to his goal would make him feel like he was 60 again and cause him to rush off and do something a bit impulsive and daring??? I don't know. I was sort of kidding...

Grond · Feb 19, 2002

I am totally with Harad on this one. I cannot rationalize the heir to both the throne of Gondor and Arnor wandering around the wilderness without a viable weapon. Call me old fashioned but I want my hero to be armed for war. I had never thought about the situation, mainly because hand to hand combat didn't really come up until after Narsil was reforged. Oh well. We can't have everything perfect all the time.

No..... I wonder why Gandalf took the Fellowship through Moria when the Gap of Rohan would have been so much better of a choice.

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