Irresponsibility at the Council of 🧝Elrond

As Gandalf pointed out, Sauron had little or no knowledge of Hobbits, which gave them a big advantage. Sauron would expect a Man, Elf, Dwarf, or even Gandalf to take charge of the Ring, and would keep as close a watch on them as he could. Sauron would not expect them to put their hopes into such a small, and to him, weak race.

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Well I do not think this would make a difference because Sauron was not looking for anyone to come to his kingdom and attempt to destroy his Ring because he could not conceive the thought of someone trying to destroy the Ring, that thougt never entered his mind....

Originally posted by Feanorian
Well I do not think this would make a difference because Sauron was not looking for anyone to come to his kingdom and attempt to destroy his Ring because he could not conceive the thought of someone trying to destroy the Ring, that thougt never entered his mind....

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Great point, it goes with what I was trying to say, but I didn't get it out. Sauron did not think that anyone would try to destroy the Ring, but he would think that either Gandalf, an Elf, or a Man would have it and use it against him, so the Hobbits would have been of little concern to him. He knew a Hobbit carried the Ring to Rivendell, and then from Rivendell the Hobbit left in the company of Gandalf and others who might have the power to use the Ring against him. Whether Sauron still thought the Hobbit had the Ring or had passed it on to someone more powerful, who knows, but IMO he would have seen the Hobbits as probably nothing more then servants and helpers then anything else, Gandalf's cronies.

Yikes! I missed too much! I had lots to say about the Dwarves again, but I probably won't do it now. I came up with a crazy idea. Tom Bombadil. He'd do a good job even if he didn't care about the One Ring. It looks like nothing can touch him as long as he can sing. All he'd need is the rest of the fellowship there to remind him what he's supposed to be doing.

Instead of arguing why I think they were irresponsible let me lay out what I would have suggested if I were at the council of Elrond:

"The ring stays in Rivendel while Aragorn, Gandalf, and a host of Rangers and Elf warriors seek out Radagast the Brown. Upon finding Radagast, seek out or summon the great eagle Gwaihir. Have Radagast open a dialogue with the eagles letting them know what will befall if the ring gets into the hands of Sauron. Even the eagles would be affected by this. They helped Gandalf and Bilbo in the past under much less important circumstances. I think they would help in such dire need again. Send a dozen eagles to Rivendell to take Frodo (the ring bearer), Gandalf, and Radagast to Mordor. Leave at night and fly high to avoid detection. No movement is to occur during the day. During the day rest in high peaks inacessible from the ground. Follow the Misty Mts. south over the Gap of Rohan. From their follow the Ered Nimrais into Gondor. The final resting point should be on Mt. Mindolluin. At nightfall, nine of the eagles will leave from Mindolluin flying low, yet high enough to avoid arrow shot from the ground. This will be the diversion. A few minutes later the remaining three eagles (the three fastest) each carrynig Frodo, Gandalf, and Radagast will head straight to Mt. Doom. The first nine eagles will scatter every which way into Mordor but towards Orodruin drawing attention away from the ring bearer. The three will land near Sammath Naur. Gandalf and Radagast enter into Sammath Naur with Frodo to witness the destruction of the ring and to prevent any mischief, keeping a close leash on Frodo. Cast the ring in and get out as quickly as possible. Return the three to Rivendell. And the eagles will be granted a reward that Radagast will negotiate."

That would be my plan. I think it is a lot safer, quicker, and just as stealthy as the council's plan. Too much could have and did go wrong with their method. My plan was more parsimonious and guarenteed a much higher percentage of success. It also would have stopped Sauron before his forces built up too much. The council of Elrond came up with a plan that put the ringbearer into too much peril. They were irresponsible.

Once again, I am not saying that is how Tolkien should have written it. I am pointing out how the characters in the story made a poor, hasty plan to destroy the ring.

Interesting to say the least. If it worked though, you do realize that someone would have to push Frodo into Mount Doom. Hhehehe, that's a funny thought. "I'm sorry Frodo my lad, but this must be done!" *push*
Good point though, Hadafang.

Interesting to say the least. If it worked though, you do realize that someone would have to push Frodo into Mount Doom. Hhehehe, that's a funny thought. "I'm sorry Frodo my lad but this must be done!" *push*

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That is funny. But why would they have to push him?

I was actualy thinking that Sam would have to end up pushing Frodo in when I was reading the book. Then I thought Gollum would dive in after the Ring, and Sam would be all alone. Sam always was my favorite hobbit.

What's all of this craziness about Radagast? The evil torturer Gandalf seemed like a good friend with those eagles most of the time. Why waste time getting Radagast when all they had to do was head over to the Misty Mountains and let the evil torturer Gandalf talk to them? Anyways, what's wrong with my Tom Bombadil idea?

Yay Gollum I don't think Tom Bombadil could have done this.
Gandalf states in The Council of Elrond chapter:

And now he (Tom Bombadil) is withdrawn into a little land, within bounds that he has set, though none can see them, waiting perhaps for a change of days, and he will not step beyond them.

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Yay Gollum: Why waste time getting Radagast when all they had to do was head over to the Misty Mountains and let the evil torturer Gandalf talk to them?

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This is probably the most overly cautious step in my plan. two wizrds are better than one. Also Radagast the brown was the wizard that handled animals the best. He would be able to persuade the eagles easier than Gandalf in my opinion.Gandalf states in the Council of Elrond chapter:

Send out messages to all the beasts and birds that are your friends.

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Radagast clearly had good contacts.

That first quote is just craziness. It's just the opinion of the evil torturer Gandalf as far as I can tell. There's nothing that actually proves that. Anyways, yes, sure, I guess the two wizard thing would make sense. I kind of thought that they were in a hurry, though.

I do think that the choice of ringbearer and the way the ring got to Mt. Doom were chosen irresponsibly and not completely thought through, but what could they have done with the people they had and the time frame they had? I believe they did pretty well under the circumstances. They were in a hurry. Sauron's men were coming, and they couldn't have just sat there waving the ring while they tried to think of a better route to Mordor. Just my opinion!

And as for Tom Bombadil, I think it is said sometime in the CoE that he would forget why the ring is important and probably give it away or throw it away.

My personal opinion is that there were some mistakes that were done during the council.The decision to let Frodo and Sam to go is right and they prove it,especially Frodo.But I doubt about Merry and Pippin's participation.They really did some things that influenced negatively.I think they did mistakes because they were quite unexperienced,and that was probably the mistake- to leave unexperienced hobbits to go with you.But later,they both gain cognition from life and become of great imortance for the war.So I repeat the long-known saying:"Everything is good when it finishes in a good way."

Clearly it wasn't too bad an idea to send Hobbits as the ring was destroyed wasn't it?

I like Yay's idea about Tom Bombadil.

And as for Tom Bombadil, I think it is said sometime in the CoE that he would forget why the ring is important and probably give it away or throw it away.

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I think that Yay already answered that.

All he'd need is the rest of the fellowship there to remind him what he's supposed to be doing.

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That first quote is just craziness. It's just the opinion of the evil torturer Gandalf as far as I can tell. There's nothing that actually proves that.

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Bombadil himself states what Gandalf thinks.

From The Fog on the Barrow-Downs

They begged him to come at least as far as the inn and drink once more with them; but [Tom] laughed and refused, saying:
Tom's country ends here; he will not pass the boarders.
Tom has his house to mind, and Goldberry is waiting!

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There we go. Thank you very much, Mithlond person! I hate to stop discussions like that. Anyways, still, *sniff* who knows? Lots of people asking him to help out might work. That Goldberry person seemed more sensible, too.

Sorry to spoil the fun there YayGollum, it just had to be done.

Why say sorry when I thanked you for it? oh well. I'd like to see what other people have to say about the crazy views in this thread. sorry if I slowed things down.

So far I have seen noone come up with a better plan then Hadhafang Plan listed above......wierd to think of myself wiser than a wizard and a High Elf.

Well, of course you'd go for your own idea. What were mine again? oh well. Sure, having Radagast to help out would be fun, but I don't see why they'd even think of that. We happen to know that Gandalf was always talking to those people, too. It wouldn't be a huge deal for them to walk over and ask for some help.