Second-guessing and Misunderstanding Tolkien

Vorondil · Oct 17, 2023

Ent said:
John Sedgwick
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
This article is about the American military officer. For the American author, see John Sedgwick (author).
Not to be confused with John Sedgewick.

John Sedgwick

Sedgwick in the 1860s
Nickname(s) "Uncle John"
Born September 13, 1813
Cornwall, Connecticut, U.S.
Died May 9, 1864 (aged 50)
Spotsylvania County, Virginia, U.S.
Buried Cornwall Hollow Cemetery (Cornwall, Connecticut)
Allegiance United States
Service/branch United States Army
Union Army
Years of service 1837–1864
Rank Major general
Commands held VI Corps
Battles/wars Seminole Wars
Mexican–American War
Utah War
Indian Wars
American Civil War †
Other work Teacher
Signature

John Sedgwick (September 13, 1813 – May 9, 1864) was a military officer and Union Army general during the American Civil War.
He was wounded three times at the Battle of Antietam while leading his division in an unsuccessful assault against Confederate forces, causing him to miss the Battle of Fredericksburg. Under his command, the VI Corps played an important role in the Chancellorsville Campaign by engaging Confederate troops at the Second Battle of Fredericksburg and the Battle of Salem Church. His corps was the last to arrive at the Battle of Gettysburg and thus did not see much action. Sedgwick was killed by a sharpshooter at the Battle of Spotsylvania Court House on May 9, 1864, making him and Major Generals James B. McPherson, Joseph K. Mansfield, and John F. Reynolds the highest-ranking Union officers to be killed in the war. He is remembered for an ironic remark among his last words: "They couldn't hit an elephant at this distance."

I honestly did not think that was true.

Ent · Oct 17, 2023

Aethelwulf said:
I honestly did not think that was true.

It's in Wikipedia, so who knows... it may not be.
But Wikipedia is a lot more accurate than it used to be.
I didn't check it anywhere else yet.

Vorondil · Oct 17, 2023

Ent said:
It's in Wikipedia, so who knows... it may not be.
But Wikipedia is a lot more accurate than it used to be.
I didn't check it anywhere else yet.

Wikipedia tends to be fairly accurate, I think.

Ent · Oct 17, 2023

Turns out it's also listed in Britannica I guess.

Major General John Sedgwick was the highest-ranking Union officer killed during the Civil War. Just before he was shot, his last words were, “They couldn’t hit an elephant at this distance.”

Vorondil · Oct 17, 2023

Ent said:
Turns out it's also listed in Britannica I guess.

Major General John Sedgwick was the highest-ranking Union officer killed during the Civil War. Just before he was shot, his last words were, “They couldn’t hit an elephant at this distance.”

Those have got to be the most ridiculous last words ever recorded!

Ent · Oct 17, 2023

Yeah, in my VERY brief reading of it, it seems the fellow who nailed him was a sharpshooter... and of course, those guys were always targeting the officers.

One must be cautious what one says. Irony is ever at hand.

Deimos · Oct 17, 2023

Squint-eyed Southerner said:
"They couldn't hit an elephant at this dista--"

Last words of Major General John Sedgewick, Battle of Spotsylvania Courthouse, 1864.

"Truth is stranger than fiction" aka "You couldn't make that up."

Vorondil · Oct 17, 2023

Deimos said:
"Truth is stranger than fiction" aka "You couldn't make that up."

''Life is infinitely stranger than anything which the mind of man could invent.''

Olorgando · Oct 17, 2023

Aethelwulf said:
''Life is infinitely stranger than anything which the mind of man could invent.''

That sounds like it was stolen from J.B.S. Haldane (though independent arrival at at least similar conclusions can never be discounted, there's been too many of them): "My own suspicion is that the universe is not only queerer than we suppose, but queerer than we can suppose."[.

Deimos · Oct 17, 2023

Olorgando said:
That sounds like it was stolen from J.B.S. Haldane (though independent arrival at at least similar conclusions can never be discounted, there's been too many of them): "My own suspicion is that the universe is not only queerer than we suppose, but queerer than we can suppose."[.

'Tis strange -- but true; for truth is always strange; Stranger than fiction..." —Lord Byron's Don Juan (1823)

Olorgando · Oct 17, 2023

Deimos said:
'Tis strange -- but true; for truth is always strange; Stranger than fiction..." —Lord Byron's Don Juan (1823)

I wouldn't be surprised if digging with JRRT's determination landed us by the Greek troika Aristotle, Plato and Socrates. With hints pointing towards Mesopotamian and Indus Valley sources (those classical Greeks were very cavalier about acknowledging copyright ... 🤥 ).

Deimos · Oct 17, 2023

Olorgando said:
I wouldn't be surprised if digging with JRRT's determination landed us by the Greek troika Aristotle, Plato and Socrates. With hints pointing towards Mesopotamian and Indus Valley sources (those classical Greeks were very cavalier about acknowledging copyright ... 🤥 ).

Nihil sub sole novum. ([Vulgate] Ecclesiastes 1:9.... c. 450 BC ... give or take a few centuries)

Vorondil · Oct 18, 2023

Olorgando said:
That sounds like it was stolen from J.B.S. Haldane

Actually, I stole it from Sherlock Holmes. He has a quote for every situation.

Glorfindel Goldtress · Oct 18, 2023

It does sound quite Sherlocky, come to think of it.

Server Room Gremlin · Oct 18, 2023

Ent said:
Yeah, in my VERY brief reading of it, it seems the fellow who nailed him was a sharpshooter... and of course, those guys were always targeting the officers.

One must be cautious what one says. Irony is ever at hand.

Sometimes, even be careful what you think, as the ears of the future are very sharp.

Olorgando · Oct 18, 2023

Aethelwulf said:
Actually, I stole it from Sherlock Holmes. He has a quote for every situation.

You are aware that Arthur Conan Doyle probably stole a lot from Edgar Allan Poe?

Vorondil · Oct 18, 2023

Olorgando said:
You are aware that Arthur Conan Doyle probably stole a lot from Edgar Allan Poe?

Are you telling me that Sherlock Holmes isn't a real person?!

Olorgando · Oct 18, 2023

Aethelwulf said:
Are you telling me that Sherlock Holmes isn't a real person?!

If I need to tell you I probably won't bother ... 🤐

Radaghast · Oct 18, 2023

When Morgoth stole the Silmarils and killed the Two Trees, why didn't the Ainur and all the elves immediately chase humans imprison him again? Surely even Orome chasing after him could have saved a lot of bother.

Would've saved you a lot of bother if you'd bothered to read the book (and proofread your question).

Vorondil · Oct 18, 2023

Radaghast said:
When Morgoth stole the Silmarils and killed the Two Trees, why didn't the Ainur and all the elves immediately chase humans imprison him again? Surely even Orome chasing after him could have saved a lot of bother.
Would've saved you a lot of bother if you'd read the book (and proofread your question).

I actually have a hard time understanding that.

John Sedgwick
Sedgwick in the 1860s
Nickname(s)	"Uncle John"
Born	September 13, 1813 Cornwall, Connecticut, U.S.
Died	May 9, 1864 (aged 50) Spotsylvania County, Virginia, U.S.
Buried	Cornwall Hollow Cemetery (Cornwall, Connecticut)
Allegiance	United States
Service/branch	United States Army Union Army
Years of service	1837–1864
Rank	Major general
Commands held	VI Corps
Battles/wars	Seminole Wars Mexican–American War Utah War Indian Wars American Civil War †
Other work	Teacher
Signature

Second-guessing and Misunderstanding Tolkien

Inquisitor Lord, of the Ordo Spammicus

John Sedgwick​

Silently Observing Observed Silence

Inquisitor Lord, of the Ordo Spammicus

Silently Observing Observed Silence

Major General John Sedgwick was the highest-ranking Union officer killed during the Civil War. Just before he was shot, his last words were, “They couldn’t hit an elephant at this distance.”​

Inquisitor Lord, of the Ordo Spammicus

Major General John Sedgwick was the highest-ranking Union officer killed during the Civil War. Just before he was shot, his last words were, “They couldn’t hit an elephant at this distance.”​

Silently Observing Observed Silence

Elite

Inquisitor Lord, of the Ordo Spammicus

Resident Curmudgeon Award by Hal :-)

Elite

Resident Curmudgeon Award by Hal :-)

Elite

Inquisitor Lord, of the Ordo Spammicus

The Later the Joy the Greater the Gain

a.k.a. Curufin the Crafty

Resident Curmudgeon Award by Hal :-)

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Resident Curmudgeon Award by Hal :-)

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Inquisitor Lord, of the Ordo Spammicus

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John Sedgwick

Major General John Sedgwick was the highest-ranking Union officer killed during the Civil War. Just before he was shot, his last words were, “They couldn’t hit an elephant at this distance.”

Major General John Sedgwick was the highest-ranking Union officer killed during the Civil War. Just before he was shot, his last words were, “They couldn’t hit an elephant at this distance.”