Why didn't the Rangers go South?

[Arvedui]

To know that the thing that can change the destiny of the world is within reach and you just watch it and guard it?!?!

Exactly.
Until you know what to do with it, then I would say that was the best thing to do.
What would your idea be, then? That the Chieftain of the Dúnedain should take the Ring for himself, and use it to be able to accomplish the overthrow of Sauron? Some might think that would have been a good idea. Some, like Boromir and Denethor...

And as some have stated by now: the Shire was a part of their former Kingdom, so why not take care of it? If you are too few to accomplish great deeds, then at least stay honourable, and accomplish the little things that you can do!
Remember Aragorn when the army of the West came to the desolation before the gates of the Pass of Cirith Gorgor, and some of the host vere unmanned and unable to go forth:

'Go!' said Aragorn. 'But keep what honour you may, and do not run! And there is a task which you may attempt and so be not wholly shamed. Take your way south-west till you come to Cair Andros, and if that is still held by enemies, as I think, then re-take it, if you can; and hold it to the last in defence of Gondor and Rohan!'
Then some being shamed by his mercy overcame their fear and went on, and others took new hope, hearing of a manful deed within their measure that they could turn to, and they departed.

Who should now the worth of such actions better than one who had lived his whole life doing exactly that?

 

[gate7ole]

Beleg, I don’t disagree with your excellent analysis over the mannish populations of Eriador. But why don’t you think for once that this situation was in a way a result of the negligence of the Rangers to establish a new realm? It would be hard at the beginning, that’s certain. But at the end of the TA, their kingdom might be prosperous.
But what did they expect? Even with the arrival of the “chosen-one”, the situation at the North wouldn’t be different. And in fact, Aragorn did eventually leave his land for Minas Tirith. Despite what we say that they wanted to protect their lands and not leave, they did.

Lhun, you persistently try to add this mystic aspect of guarding the Shire . I think that Eriol answered this part. It was Gandalf’s orders to Aragorn.

 

[Eriol]

Originally posted by Lhunithiliel
This must be for some major plan! .... Which leads me to a thought: Say, and what if Manwe and Eru had had a "private chat" with good old Olorin and explained to him the whole "plan" and then sent him to ME in order to fulfill this plan?

No plan, Lhun... Frodo could have refused the burden outright. He could have thrown the Ring away as soon as he heard about it (I know, it is hard to throw it away, but he had never worn the Ring as far as we know, and he was dismayed by the news). He could have given it to Tom Bombadil. He could have given it to Aragorn. The Witch-King could have killed Aragorn before he ever met the hobbits.

etc. etc. .... All of it completely beyond Gandalf's control.

The "big plan" was unknown to all but Eru. It depended on all sort of personal choices completely beyond the reach of any other power, including Manwë -- and certainly Olórin. If Gandalf knew it all, why make so many blunders? A favorite topic in debates is "Was Gandalf right in...". For the wisest of the Maiar to make so many mistakes, KNOWING the plan, is unthinkable.

Fact is, he knew nothing. He was "playing it by ear". And this ignorance of Olórin was, after all, part of the plan...

 

[Lantarion]

Originally posted by gate7ole
Lhun, you persistently try to add this mystic aspect of guarding the Shire. I think that Eriol answered this part. It was Gandalf’s orders to Aragorn.

Perhaps: but this has been discussed before, because it is quite an ambiguous topic:
here

 

[Beleg]

But why don’t you think for once that this situation was in a way a result of the negligence of the Rangers to establish a new realm? It would be hard at the beginning, that’s certain. But at the end of the TA, their kingdom might be prosperous.

AppendixA
After Arvedui the Northern Kingdom ended, for the Dunedain were now few and all the people of Eriador diminished.

This Quote to me shows that Even if they wanted The Dunedain didn't have enuf resources to continue their rule.
And besides even if the Dunedain would have openly proclaimed their heirship, all they would have to do would have been to protect their masses, which were few in numbers and in whose protection they seemed to be successful without publically going out as a Kingdom.


Okay, I am begining to agree with you at some points. But I still fail to see how Dunedain were at fault for issuing the line of Chieftains?

 

[gate7ole]

Originally posted by Beleg_strongbow
This Quote to me shows that Even if they wanted The Dunedain didn't have enuf resources to continue their rule.
And besides even if the Dunedain would have openly proclaimed their heirship, all they would have to do would have been to protect their masses, which were few in numbers and in whose protection they seemed to be successful without publically going out as a Kingdom.

Well, look at the advantages of establishing a kingdom and not just protecting the masses in secrecy.
People would start to feel safer, that there is some protection. They would organize better their cities, not fearing of invasions all the time. The bad groups would think twice before attacking inhabitands of the kingdom etc.
In general, it would be much easier to prosper under the shelter of a kingdom.

Okay, I am begining to agree with you at some points. But I still fail to see how Dunedain were at fault for issuing the line of Chieftains?

Well, as always, the truth is somewhere in the middle.

 

[Lhunithiliel]

Originally posted by Eriol
No plan, Lhun... Frodo could have refused the burden outright. He could have thrown the Ring away as soon as he heard about it (I know, it is hard to throw it away, but he had never worn the Ring as far as we know, and he was dismayed by the news). He could have given it to Tom Bombadil. He could have given it to Aragorn. The Witch-King could have killed Aragorn before he ever met the hobbits.

etc. etc. .... All of it completely beyond Gandalf's control.

The "big plan" was unknown to all but Eru. It depended on all sort of personal choices completely beyond the reach of any other power, including Manwë -- and certainly Olórin. If Gandalf knew it all, why make so many blunders? A favorite topic in debates is "Was Gandalf right in...". For the wisest of the Maiar to make so many mistakes, KNOWING the plan, is unthinkable.

Fact is, he knew nothing. He was "playing it by ear". And this ignorance of Olórin was, after all, part of the plan...

So...you confused me here! Once you say there was not any plan and then...that all was a part of a plan...
Now, I know that the idea about a plan discussed "behind closed doors" that I joked about is just an idea but I like throwing in ideas to be discussed
I personnly can hardly see the presence of any plan and if therewas one, it perhaps concerned more the presence of the wizards in ME in order to counter and check the the growing strength of Sauron over ME.
Whether there was a specific plan about the Ring and it being kept in the Shire, therefore the Shire to be guarded by the Rangers.... I doubt it...though... who knows?!

To me it does seem strange that the people from the once proud Arnor decided to vanish into the shades and dedicate all their exceptional skills and knowledge to killing evil creatures in the woods and guarding a little piece of land .... I just see no good reason in this...and as I believe that Tolkien created every bit in his mythological world for some good reason.... I am trying to find out what this reason would be in the case of the Rangers and their people.
That's why I constantly bring forward the issue about the hard-to-understand decision of the Rangers. I somehow feel there is sth. behind this!

 

[Eriol]

If you had colored the first sentence of the next-to-last paragraph -- "The 'big plan' was unknown to all but Eru" -- it would make sense.



It was not a "decision" by the Rangers, it was thrust upon them. They were diminished, their kingdom was deserted. They would probably prefer to keep on being kings, but they no longer had a kingdom.

 

[Eledhwen]

Perhaps the Rangers just liked Longbottom Leaf! Gandalf was already well fond of it by the White Council of 2581. It was at this time that he began to suspect that Saruman's motives for forestalling the attack on Dol Guldur were not as pure as they should have been; and though Gandalf dismissed his suspicions, he may have suggested the watch on the Shire:

"Gandalf ... looking keenly at Saruman he drew on his pipe and sent out a great ring of smoke with many smaller rings that followed it. Then he put up his hand, as if to grasp them, and they vanished. With that he got up and left Saruman without another word; but Saruman stood for some time silent, and his face was dark with doubt and displeasure... doubting whether he read rightly the purport of Gandalf's gesture with the rings of smoke (above all whether it showed any connexion between the Halflings and the great matter of the Rings of Power, unlikely though that might seem); and doubting that one so great could concern himself with such a people as the Halflings for their own sake merely."

The following account was struck through:

It was a strange chance, that being angered by his insolence Gandalf chose this way of showing to Saruman his suspicion that the desire to possess them had begun to enter into his policies and his study of the lore of the Rings; and of warning him that they would elude him. For it cannot be doubted that Gandalf had as yet no thought that the Halflings (and still less their smoking) had any connection with the Rings. If he had any such thought, then certainly he would not have done then what he did. Yet later when the Halflings did indeed become involved in this greatest matter, Saruman could believe only that Gandalf had known or foreknown this, and had concealed the knowledge from him and from the Council for just such a purpose as Saruman would conceive: to gain possession and to forestall him.

Just as it was Gandalf's foresight that persuaded the Dwarves to take a Hobbit on their adventure; so this foresight was already in place ninety years earlier at the White Council.

Also, it could be that the Rangers (or maybe Aragorn and his Ancestors) simply particularly loved the region and wanted it preserved unsullied. The simple Bree-folk and the Hobbits of the Shire had something special - an uncomplicated lifestyle that would be lost if the dark shadow spread unchecked. Also, the exiled king had no guarantee of a welcome in Gondor; his arrival may well have sparked a civil war if the Steward was unwilling. A man like Boromir in his pride, for instance. Even when the time was ripe, Aragorn was careful not to overstep the mark until his welcome was clear.