Aegnor and Orodreth - about marriage

[Andreth]

Even if, reading the Athrabeth, I thought that the choice of Aegnor - not to marry the woman he loved, Andreth - made sense, at least when considered more closely, there is surely the matter that Orodreth - brother or nephew to Aegnor, if you like - did indeed marry in Middle-Earth, at least according to the Peoples of Middle-Earth; he married a Sinda, in fact. To explain this, I thought that at least Orodreth may have married during the time of the secrecy of Nargothrond, when they in fact didn't expect open war: surely, at the time of the arrival of Turin, Gil-Galad must have been a still a kid, otherwise he would not have had suffered to be addressed to Cirdan with his mother, he surely would have been in Nargothrond as Finduilas, so maybe Orodreth's marriage was quite recent...
what do you think about this matter? Do you find the matter of marriage during wartime a bit ambiguous among Elves? I thought that probably Aegnor thought( knowing that he was doomed to die before his wife, most likely in battle ) he would not suffer to leave alone his wife when she would need him the most, when she was old and during a war... After all, he was said to be " a generous and noble spirit ", this would make sense to me. But, what about you?

 

[Andreth]

UP! I'm curious to know your opinions about this matter

 

[Matthew Bailey01]

Aegnor would have married an Elf, thus there would have been no "when she was old." Unless I am missing something.

There is also the difficulty that Tolkien had said he needed to lengthen the First Age, to account for the Fall of Man, and the flight of the Edain to Beleriand.

Thus, the "time of war" would not have been continuous war. Even as it stands, for nearly 500 years, the Siege of Angband remained fast.

MRB


I obviously take Middle-earth too seriously!

 

[Ricardo]

Interesting question. Yes, Finrod told Andreth that Aegnor didn't marry her because they were at war.

I find it strange and I think the main reason was that he would see Andreth get old and eventually die and preferred to not go through it.

But it's strange because he made her suffer, and he would still suffer for her, wouldn't have been some time together better than no time?

Luthien married Beren, I know they were both sent back but Luthien didn't know that at the time she decided to marry Beren.

Idril marry Tuor, again, many think (me included) that Tuor was made an elf and therefore they will be together until the end of Arda, yet, Idril didn't know that.

Same can be said about Nimloth marrying Dior.

I think Luthien, Idril and Nimloth thought that they at least could share some time with the person they loved. If they hadn't married they would still had missed them. We know that elves's love is supposed to be forever and that's not just a law, that's how elves feel.

I guess we are not the same and Aegnor saw things differently.

 

[Tyelkormo the Fair]

I think it was more about that Andreth was a mortal woman and not the matter of war. I imagine the Noldor and the Sindar mingled their blood through marriage during the time of peace. Also, marriage was not prohibited, merely advised against.

I don't know much about the version where Gil-Galad is the son of Orodreth, tbh. 😅
Ereinion Fingonion for the win!

 

[Ricardo]

I think it was more about that Andreth was a mortal woman and not the matter of war. I imagine the Noldor and the Sindar mingled their blood through marriage during the time of peace. Also, marriage was not prohibited, merely advised against.

I don't know much about the version where Gil-Galad is the son of Orodreth, tbh. 😅
Ereinion Fingonion for the win!

It's not clear, Aegnor is a very passive character in the Silmarillion and Andreth doesn't appear at all. All we have is what Finrod said about marriage in times of war. But I agree with you. It didn't make a lot of sense to wait considering that Andreth was mortal and they didn't have much time.

About Gil-Galad, in late writings, Tolkien changed the genealogy of the Noldor. Orodreth was no longer Finrod/Angrod/Aegnor/Galadriel's brother but Angrod's son (his mother was Eldalote) and Gil-Galad was Orodreth's son and Finduilas's brother, not Fingon's son.

Christopher Tolkien said it was a mistake he made in the published Silmarillion but later said it would have been better to not disclose Gil Galad's ancestry.

I think one reason why Tolkien changed his mind was that if Gil Galad was Fingon's son, he should have succeeded his father as high-king of the Noldor, not Turgon.

Not sure why the Orodreth change but it made sense to put Gil Galad in the house of Finarfin. Finrod wouldn't have children since his beloved Amarie didn't follow him to Middle Earth. Aegnor was out because of Andreth and Galadriel was in Doriath (not good for a Noldor prince) so it was either Angrod or Orodreth.

I also believe that CT knew this before the Silmarillion was published, but changing Gil Galad's parentage would introduce other plot changes, like the story of Fingon sending him with Cirdan.

 

[Ricardo]

You can argue that the title of high-king of the Noldor wasn't necessarily tied to ancestry but more to merit. When Fingon died, Gil Galad was still young (in elves terms) and he didn't have a kingdom of his own (or experience).

Not that Turgon did much better because he was limited to Gondolin only.