Evil women in The Lord of the Rings

[Ricardo]

Lobelia wasn't evil, she was annoying, greedy, but not evil, perfectly demonstrated by what she did at the end.

Beruthiel is a too minor character to be considered, surely, she plotted, she spied on everyone, doesn't look that she was a good person, perhaps evil but with limited reach.

I can't think of anybody else. When you have big bags like Melkor, Sauron or Saruman the women look like saints.

I believe Ungoliant could be read as a female character. I have not read all the history of middle earth (I'm halfway through) but using Blind Guardian's prologue to their Tolkien themed album "Nightfall in Middle Earth", "War of Wrath", I believe she is called: "...the mistress of her own lust."

the thing with Ungoliant is that Tolkien never really told us what she/he/it is. We know what she can do, we know what she looks like, but nothing else. It's the Tom Bombadil of spiders.

 

[Eljorahir]

a major female evil human (or of human form) character but just wondering how such a character would have affected the story if it's considered possible or reasonably feasible?

I'm still going with the idea that Saruman needs a wife. Think of the possibilities:

A pairing of Saruman the Maia and Grimsha of Rohan could be a nice (oops, I mean evil) reflection of Melian and Thingol.

Saruman first sets eyes on Grimsha one evening in the woods while she's skinning an animal by firelight. Of course, he's instantly enamored and thinks: 'Now that's the gal for me!' He puts a spell on her...she throws a knife at him: True love! A match made in Angband!

...yada yada yada...

After she kills Saruman outside Bag End, the hobbits allow her to leave (it being bad form and all: killing a soon-to-be mommy.) Where she traveled or what became of her offspring (The Anti-Luthien) ... no tale tells.

 

[Greenleaf2024]

Tolkien doesn't seem to have that many women in the main tales anyway, so evil women are even more rare 😅 I mean, think about this: Elrond's wife sailed. Theoden's and Denethor's wives died. We (seemingly) know NOTHING about Thranduil's wife (which makes me mad , by the way), Frodo's mother died, etc. Yes, we have Gilraen, Luthien, Galadriel, Arwen, Eowyn (there are some female characters), but the stories seem to have limited roles for women. I haven't met Tolkien, I don't know why, maybe he just forgot and didn't realize that so many of his male characters had (apparently) absent wives, either through death or the simple calamity of not one single sentence to guarantee their existence. 🤣

All of that is to say that maybe he just didn't really write too much about women anyway, so he didn't get too detailed about Shelob, for example.

 

[Greenleaf2024]

Lobelia wasn't evil, she was annoying, greedy, but not evil, perfectly demonstrated by what she did at the end.

Beruthiel is a too minor character to be considered, surely, she plotted, she spied on everyone, doesn't look that she was a good person, perhaps evil but with limited reach.

I can't think of anybody else. When you have big bags like Melkor, Sauron or Saruman the women look like saints.


the thing with Ungoliant is that Tolkien never really told us what she/he/it is. We know what she can do, we know what she looks like, but nothing else. It's the Tom Bombadil of spiders.

Isn't Ungoliant simply an evil spirit that can take on different forms, and "she" chose to appear as a giant spider?

 

[Ricardo]

Isn't Ungoliant simply an evil spirit that can take on different forms, and "she" chose to appear as a giant spider?

Tolkien was never clear about Ungoliant, the Silmarillion says she came from beyond Arda and many interpreted it meant she was a Maia, but nothing conclusive.

 

[Ricardo]

Tolkien doesn't seem to have that many women in the main tales anyway, so evil women are even more rare 😅 I mean, think about this: Elrond's wife sailed. Theoden's and Denethor's wives died. We (seemingly) know NOTHING about Thranduil's wife (which makes me mad , by the way), Frodo's mother died, etc. Yes, we have Gilraen, Luthien, Galadriel, Arwen, Eowyn (there are some female characters), but the stories seem to have limited roles for women. I haven't met Tolkien, I don't know why, maybe he just forgot and didn't realize that so many of his male characters had (apparently) absent wives, either through death or the simple calamity of not one single sentence to guarantee their existence. 🤣

All of that is to say that maybe he just didn't really write too much about women anyway, so he didn't get too detailed about Shelob, for example.

You forgot my favourite Idril

There seems to be more women with strong characters in the Silmarillion, the already mentioned Luthien, plus Idril, Melian, Varda, Yavannah, Morwen, Nienor, Andreth (not Silmarillon but first age).

A lot less in LOTR, Arwen, Galadriel, Eowyn, Lobelia (to some extent).

None in the Hobbit except Tauriel (don't flame me, I've being sarcastic).

Only one female dwarf is ever mentioned: Dis.

 

[Greenleaf2024]

None in the Hobbit except Tauriel (don't flame me, I've being sarcastic

🤣🤣🤣

 

[Radaghast]

🤣🤣🤣

 

[Elthir]

It's not Sarugirl, it's. . .

I'm late to the Saruman chat, I know.

 

[Fingon_Findekáno]

There seems to be more women with strong characters in the Silmarillion, the already mentioned Luthien, plus Idril, Melian, Varda, Yavannah, Morwen, Nienor, Andreth (not Silmarillon but first age).

Y'all keep forgetting my sister, Aredhel!!

 

[Valandil]

Erendis?

Ancalime?

Cue up “The Evil Woman” by ELO!

 

[Radaghast]

Erendis?

Ancalime?

Cue up “The Evil Woman” by ELO!

See page 1.

 

[AaronSecret]

Maybe Tolkien's world is so perfect and honorable (I mean the good guys) cuz women are rarely involved HAHAHA
I am joking!
Jokes aside,
there's some truth in the fact I have relied on the masculine honor within the books of Tolkien to survive our world's corruption.
never thought of the fact there are a few evil women!?
yeah, when a woman is wicked, she's way worse than an evil man- no one can convince me otherwise!