Aragorn Warns 🧙Gandalf

reem · Feb 26, 2003

Why does Aragorn warn Gandalf especially not to go into the mines of moria? this is on page 390.
he says: ' it is not for the Ring, nor for any of us others that i am thinking now, but of you, Gandalf.And i say to you: if you pass the doors of Moria, beware!"
what was that all about??
reem

Aulë · Feb 26, 2003

Have you read the part where the company travels through Moria yet?
You will understand why Aragorn said that when you read what lurks in the depths of Moria.

Eriol · Feb 26, 2003

The Dúnedain had some measure of foresight. Check Halbarad statement when entering on the Paths of the Dead. The Tale of Aragorn and Arwen is sprinkled with examples of this foresight, both from Aragorn grandmother (I think -- someone says that if Arathorn and Gilraen do not marry it will be a hard blow for the hope of the Dúnedain) and from Aragorn himself, speaking with Elrond.

Bottomline: the guy just had a bad feeling about that... but his feelings, bad or good, were often accurate. He had some foresight of Gandalf's fall.

BlackCaptain · Feb 26, 2003

And Gandalf probably told Aragorn of his previous encounters in Moria, and Aragorn was making sure that Gandalf hadnt forgoten

reem · Mar 1, 2003

actually, pippin, this is the fourth time i read the book. but what i meant was how Aragorn knew that Gandalf was in trouble, if that was the meaning of the warning. if it wasn't, then what was it.
i don't think that aragorn was talking about durin's bane, though (i.e.balrog) because not even gandalf knew about it, or had met it until then.
but i think it's most likely got to do with aragorn's foresight, like Eriol said...though i didn't know that he had one until now

interesting info

must read the rest of Tolkien's work i suppose.
reem

Maeglin · Mar 1, 2003

Actually I think that they knew what was lurking in Moria ahead of time, both had already traveled through Moria, and "Durin's Bane" was spoken of on several occasions, they must have had some idea of what was there. That being said, perhaps Aragorn said this to Gandalf because if Gandalf goes into the mines he will meet one of his own kind, and possibly more powerful, and evil, and it would do anything to stop them, for it lives for evil, being ensnared by Morgoth in the first age. But that is purely speculation.

Glomund · Mar 3, 2003

I have to disagree that they knew what was in there Glorfindel, on page 341
Gimli asks, "What happened, did you meet the beater of the drums?"
and Gandalf answered

I do not know, but I found myself suddenly faced by something that I have not met before

and then later,

What it was I cannot guess

so he could not have met it on his other trip, and Aragorn could not have either or he would not be around to warn Gandalf.
Yes they use the term Durins bane alot, but I think only because they do not really know what is in Moria, as a substitute for calling it a "thing". I am sure they knew it was some sort of powerful creature, but would the Dwarves know what a Balrog was? If they didn't all they could say was that it was a big scary dude

and Gandalf admits that he had not had many dealings with dwarves, so he might not have got the whole story to figure out the clues himself.

Mithlond · Mar 3, 2003

No one knew that Durin's Bane was a Balrog. All they knew that something evil and powerful was lurking in the depths of Moria that killed off many of the Dwarves hundreds of years ago.

Maeglin · Mar 3, 2003

I have a question about that!! Did the Balrog eat the dwarves after he killed them or did he just kill them for fun or something?

FrankSinatra · Mar 4, 2003

Good one

Thats an interesting point, Glorfindel.

I dont suppose it was like Smaug, and enjoyed the taste, it was just pure evil.

Also interesting that you, and many other members use 'he' when talking about the Balrong...

Gamil Zirak · Mar 4, 2003

Gandalf (and maybe Aragorn) knew what drove the dwarves out of Moria, but it wasn't that that lead to the warning. The mine was filled with Orcs and it would be walking into a trap to go in there.

Glomund · Mar 5, 2003

Frank, Gandalf uses the male pronouns when he tells the story of his fight with it, thats why I picked it up. Its also better odds to pick the male side, I can only think of Shelob and queen Beruthial as evil females in Tolkiens books.

spirit · Mar 5, 2003

shelob is a girl?
the spidery thing? that is gonna be in the 3rd movie rite?

Niniel · Mar 5, 2003

Yes, 'lob' is an old English word for spider. So a she-lob is a female spider.

spirit · Mar 6, 2003

wow. thankz fot that! i m not really good at old english. is that latin?

Lantarion · Mar 6, 2003

Um, is what Latin? Niniel just said it was Old English..

Tolkien doesn't use any Latin in any of his place names or character names; Quenya is called the "Elven Latin", but that's it.

spirit · Mar 6, 2003

okay. so old english is not latin. thanku!

Lantarion · Mar 6, 2003

Latin was the language of the Roman Empire, and later of the Byzantine Empire, that was spoken throughout the empire; that is in all the provinces, that included modern-day france, Spain, Portugal, Italy and Britannia, as well as islands and areas around these. From Latin were shaped the languages of French, Portugese, Spanish, Reto-romanian, Italian, and the ENglish language owes over 70% (unless I am mistaken) to the influence of the Romans in the country. But Old English, I think, was largely the language of the Anglo-Saxons and early settlers of England; Latin did not touch it at all, as I understand. Middle English was a bit more like modern English..
I'm studying Spanish and Latin at the moment, and I can tell you the similarities between the two, and with words in the English language, are incredible.

spirit · Mar 6, 2003

thankz dude. that actually clears out alto of things confused in my little brain. i m not very good with languages.

reem · Mar 7, 2003

and yet, as interesting as all this is, it doesn't answer the origional question, which was :why did Aragorn warn Gandalf 'especially'??
we already established that neither Gandalf nor Aragorn nor anyone in the fellowship knew about the balrog. so why the particular warning? was it something to do with Gandalf's first entry to the mines of moria??
...what going on, durnit!!

reem

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