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A Favorite Passage

Squint-eyed Southerner

Lost in the Chetwood
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A couple of members have challenged me to post on some subjects I've mentioned in passing. They are going to take some digging around, both in LOTR and other references. Plus more serious thought than I'm normally capable of!

Unfortunately, I'm about to start a couple of weeks of heavy work: tree-cutting, vehicle- hauling, furniture-moving. . .you don't want to know. If I don't have a heart attack, I should be able to get back to those topics next month.

Meanwhile, I thought I'd leave you with this idea, sparked by a remark from new member Ithilethiel:

One of my favorite passages in LOTR is a short two-page section from "A Knife in the Dark". The hobbits have set off from Bree, accompanied by the mysterious Man from the Wilderland known as "Strider", who is leading them to a place he calls Weathertop.
The part I refer to runs from "The hills drew nearer" through "Do not speak that name so loudly!".

I've always thought that, if I ever participated in a read-aloud session of favorite passages, this is the one I would choose.

The question I'll ask you to consider is, why? Why would someone pick a passage in which, really, nothing much is happening? Any guesses?

(This is not a trick question, BTW.)
 
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My guess would be that it's just a passage that moves you somehow or affects you just by the wording. I'm sure there have been passages like this in LOTR and other books I've read where nothing huge happens but it sticks out to me because of the wording the author chose to use.
 
That's true to an extent, Erestor, but that's not really what I had in mind; there are many passages I find much more moving, in fact I mentioned a couple of "cinematic" ones in the thread I referred to, here:

http://thetolkien.forum/index.php?threads/introductions.23560/#post-516800

Perhaps I was less than clear; what I meant was, not why would someone pick such a passage (though I see that's what I said--oops!), but what is it about this particular section that would be of interest?

It's a sort of poll, you see. I'm inviting interested people to have a close read of a very small passage, to see what lies in there.
 
Personally, I think that what sets this text apart is how those naïve childish hobbits who saw and knew nothing else than the Shire start to sense how great the world really is and that important deeds occurred in a past of which they hadn’t had the slightest notion before.

That was just my interpretation – how a reader feels about a given text is sometimes quite personal.
 
That's true to an extent, Erestor, but that's not really what I had in mind; there are many passages I find much more moving, in fact I mentioned a couple of "cinematic" ones in the thread I referred to, here:

http://thetolkien.forum/index.php?threads/introductions.23560/#post-516800

Perhaps I was less than clear; what I meant was, not why would someone pick such a passage (though I see that's what I said--oops!), but what is it about this particular section that would be of interest?

It's a sort of poll, you see. I'm inviting interested people to have a close read of a very small passage, to see what lies in there.

My apologies for misunderstanding. Meroe and Rilien seem to make some good points.
 
Thanks, Erestor, but not necessary -- as I said, it was my fault for not being clear about what I was asking; probably because half my mind was occupied with thoughts of being crushed under a tree!

One hint: the passage was picked more or less at random, but not quite; in fact, it was because of the absence of important narrative action that I chose it. It allows us to examine Tolkien's technique at work without the "distractions" of exciting bits.

There. I've probably said too much; I didn’t want to point readers in a particular direction, but I would like to hear what other minds can find in a specific passage that displays the author's qualities.
 
I have the feeling it might have something to do with the meter or cadence of his writing, which perhaps is offset in an interesting way by the more tightly-structured verse in the passage. Maybe he incorporated some technical elements of his poetry writing? Including alliterative effects? But that's just a hunch...I haven't sat down to analyze the meter of this passage, if it indeed has any consistent meter.
 
Good ideas, Rilien -- though you've hit on an aspect I thought would be the least likely noticed!

I don't think I'd look for a consistency in meter, or other techniques, for that matter; not from the man who Shippey described as knowing more about the English language than anyone alive. For one thing, a regular meter would tend to turn prose into verse.

Tolkien was able to pick up and drop literary devices at will. An example: notice the limited and judicious use of onomatopoeia in the description of the path at the foot of the Weather Hills:

It dived into dells, and hugged steep banks.

Or listen to the rhythm of the first line:

The hills drew nearer.

Metrically, an iamb, a truncated foot (I forget the technical term), and a trochee. Doesn't it give a feeling of plodding feet?

The hills, drew, nearer.

That may seem a stretch, but compare the much more elaborated description in the original drafts (sorry, but I'm too beat to drag them out for a long quote), condensed down to that one short line: "the hills drew nearer". Looking closely at examples like this can enable us to take seriously the author's statement that he "labored over every sentence, almost every word".

But again, the use of specific devices like this can be found throughout the work; there are other aspects of Tolkien's approach that can also be seen, in microcosm, so to speak, in one short passage like this one. To repeat, I'm not posing a trick question or puzzle, but presenting a small section of the text for examination, to see what elements can be found there, that can then be followed into the larger work.

What, for example, are the implications of these lines at the end?

'Going to Mordor!' cried Pippin. 'I hope it won't come to that!'
'Do not speak that name so loudly!' said Strider.
 
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You certainly know how to keep us busy, Squint-eyed Southerner! Small wonder your eyes are getting a bit squint! :p

But all right I'll give it another go.

I want to refer to the small conversation. Each participant expresses his thoughts in a manner that is very characteristic for their individual personality. Simple good-natured Sam, young impulsive Pipin, thoughtful Aragorn, ... each of their individual expressions helped to further "typify" them. That includes your last two lines, I would say.

Now do tell us what was on your mind before you get under a falling tree and disappear in the abyss...! :eek:
 
Welcome to the forum, St0rmb0rn. I was actually hoping to get more thoughts on this particular passage. In fact, I believe there's a fairly recent thread on favorite parts of The Hobbit. I'll have to look.

Another good observation, Meroe. But again , despite my poorly framed OP, I'm not really asking you to guess what's in my mind (little enough, I can assure you), but what's in yours -- or rather, what you see in the passage that shows Tolkien's mind at work.

Ah, here it is , St0rmb0rn:

http://thetolkien.forum/index.php?threads/favorite-part-of-the-hobbit.1382/

Been going for 17 years, I see!
 
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OK, squint-eyed southerner, I'm curious to know what you find in this passage!
 
I find my own thoughts boring!

I'm much more interested in yours. I'll add some things at some point, if there's anything left to say. But I hope more people will take a look at the passage, and have a go. And maybe then carry what they find into their understanding and appreciation of their favorite passages.

What do you think Aragorn means by those last words? Think he was afraid Sauron might suddenly pop up?
 
I find my own thoughts boring!

I'm much more interested in yours. I'll add some things at some point, if there's anything left to say. But I hope more people will take a look at the passage, and have a go. And maybe then carry what they find into their understanding and appreciation of their favorite passages.

What do you think Aragorn means by those last words? Think he was afraid Sauron might suddenly pop up?

I had always assumed, I suppose, that he was worried about attracting any Nazgul nearby, who might be sensitive to such words. It's almost as if the name of something itself has some kind of power and shouldn't be used casually. I can think of other instances, as when someone cries "Elbereth!" that the utterance of a name has an effect. Maybe it's like a prayer? And uttering words or names associated with the Enemy, or with Evil in general would be like a "negative prayer" or a prayer to the other side. And if so, then perhaps it has "invocational" powers which Aragorn hopes not to arouse. (This also makes me remember the effect that Black Speech apparently has on people.)

Complete tangent: this makes me think of something I've noticed over the last several years--certain words seem to have lost much of their potency due to overuse and casual usage. When I was a kid, four-letter swear words were powerful indeed. Maybe it's because I was just a kid, but whenever I heard them or even saw them written or printed they had a pronounced arresting effect on me. They were words of consequence. Now they are much more commonplace, and seem to have lost much of their meaning and force. So, comparatively, they are no big deal anymore. Another word is "awesome" which through overuse has become essentially meaningless (now it just indicates something as vaguely positive, as opposed to something grand and terrible--awe-inspiring). I'm actually kind of sad about the demise of this word.

Is there a connection here? I don't know. Maybe for Tolkien words and names are more than just noises we use to communicate. Maybe they are potent symbols of entities, ideas, forces, or other things.

Hey, I've read several of your posts...boring they are not!
 
Good points, Rilien.

That first one is the kind of thing I'm sort of after, as I indicated; there are elements in the passage representative of themes and devices that appear throughout the work. Close examination of a small section can reveal some of them.

Your follow-on isn't a tangent at all, IMO. Tolkien was "professionally interested" in words, to quote Gandalf, and his involvement with their history and significance was very deep, deeper than most of us probably appreciate. Shippey investigated this in his two books (see his discussion of the possible origins of the concepts of warg and wraith, for example), and the fairly recent book about Tolkien's time working on the OED, The Ring of Words, brings this out as well.

Indeed, as you note, Shippey emphasizes that is not the meaning of the Ring inscription that causes such pain and dismay, when Gandalf recites it at Rivendell, but the language:

The change in the wizard's voice was astounding. Suddenly it became menacing, powerful, harsh as stone. A shadow seemed to pass over the high sun, and the porch for a moment grew dark. All trembled, and the Elves stopped their ears.

'Never before has any voice dared to utter words of that tongue in Imladris, Gandalf the Grey,' said Elrond, as the shadow passed and the company breathed once more.

Given Tolkien's fascination with words and language, it should come as no surprise that he would construct a world in which they have an almost physical force.

If you've never seen the film "Hope and Glory", there's a scene in which a boy is taken to task by his fellows for using a word they consider so special and powerful, that it must be reserved for almost "sacred" occasions. Of course, the film is set during and right after WWII.

I share your regret on the seeming demise of language. In part, it may be due to the fading out of the study of rhetoric in the twentieth century, and in part, perhaps as a consequence, an increase, even among the educated, of a looseness and imprecision in the use of words. I think of the conflating of "enormity" and "enormousness", for example, leading to a state in which the former seems to have lost its original meaning completely.

And this regret was shared by Tolkien, I'm sure; it was happening in his day as well, as he indicates in the section "On Translation" in the Appendices.

PS: I'd "like" your post, if not for the feeling that it's a little unseemly to do so on one that pays you a compliment.

I do like it, though!
 
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My thoughts: There is a lot to be found in this short passage, but I think Merroe has hit the nail on the head: At least on first reading I mostly like the interactions between the Hobbits and Strider, and the Hobbits becoming exposed to the whole wide world. Up until now, their adventures have been mostly 'Hobbit adventures', both in the sense that they have been rather episodic like Bilbo's adventures in 'The Hobbit', and in the sense that it is conceivable other Hobbits may have had similar adventures: expeditions into the Old Forest certainly, maybe meeting Tom Bombadil, possibly also being attacked by barrow-wights, and again certainly visiting Bree. But now the Hobbits are really leaving the familiar behind and experience the world outside their little bubble (would this area beyond Bree still be on any Hobbit maps?).

On a closer reading I keep finding stuff to like about the passage however, so here goes:

1) The personification of the landscape itself: This happens several times in this passage, here are some examples: 'The hills drew nearer', '[the track] ran cunningly, taking a line that seemed chosen so as to keep as much hidden as possible from the view', 'hewn stones that screened the travellers', 'a rough crown on the old hill's head'. Such personifications make Middle-Earth really more than just a setting of the story, and rather like an actual character with it's own agenda. This is of course found over and over in the books, and it is often seen that the land remembers its inhabitants and takes on some of their character. This area having been part of Arnor then unsurprisingly seems quite helpful to the Hobbits traveling in companionship with Elendil's heir.

2) Aragorn's description of Weathertop seems almost symbolic of the fate of his own line:
It was burned and broken, and nothing remains of it now but a tumbled ring, like a rough crown on the old hill's head. Yet once it was tall and fair. It is told that Elendil stood there [...]'​
Note both the mention of a crown and the explicit connection to Elendil.

3) It also hinted at that Strider already knows much more about Frodo and the Hobbits than he let on before. Previously he seemed to know of their business only from Gandalf and just seemed to have general knowledge of the Shire and it's inhabitants. But on the Fall of Gil-Galad he says here that
Bilbo must have translated it. I never knew that.​
That seems to imply that this is something Strider could have known, i.e. that he knows Bilbo personally, and probably quite closely to normally know about Bilbo's poetry and other writings. This is the case, of course, as we learn later. But if Strider knows Bilbo closely enough to share in his poetry, then surely he has also heard all about Frodo and to some extent his friends. This then throws a new light on his first meeting with Frodo & friends in the Prancing Pony.

4) In general this passage contains many themes that are also to be found in the larger story: Theses themes include but are not limited to:
  • The interaction of land and inhabitants with the overgrown walls and remains of Arnorian buildings,
  • The Hobbits being put out of their comfort zone into the wide world,
  • The sense of decline with the ruined watch tower and mention of the Last Alliance and Gil-Galad,
  • 'Historic depth' with the hinting at the conflict of Arnor and Angmar,
  • 'Textual depth' with the hinting at the full 'Fall of Gil-Galad' as is found in so many places where Tolkien had written some longer version, often in poetry, of some event only mentioned briefly in the text,
  • The notion of the narrative frame as the reader is reminded that what we read here was 'in the story' actually written by some of the characters we know,
  • Mention of the 'ancient tongues'
I agree that it is a great passage, and maybe this is why for me: It contains so many elements that intrigue me about the Lord of the Rings as a whole.

On the last lines: I agree with Rilien. Some words seem to carry power in themselves, and (at least Aragorn seems to think) it is not wise to utter them carelessly. I'll just throw in this quote from the previous chapter, where the word 'Mordor' comes up as well:
[Frodo:] These Black Riders: I am not sure, but I think, I fear they come from -'
'They come from Mordor,' said Strider in a low voice. 'From Mordor, Barliman, if that means anything to you.'
[...]
'I am,' said Mr. Butterbur. 'More than ever. Though I don't know what the likes of me can do against, against -' he faltered.
'Against the Shadow in the East,' said Strider quietly.
​
Note how both Frodo and Butterbur don't want to or can't quite utter the name, and even Strider says it 'in a low voice' and then uses some other term. Now is this restriction self-imposed, like the 'You-know-who' in Harry Potter, or is there some deeper reason for not using the word casually?
Drifting completely into speculation, I could also imagine a combination of both, where saying 'Mordor' actually does have some power, maybe the Ringwraiths are particularly sensitive to that word and can hear it over greater distances, and therefore usage of the word was 'banned' in ancient Arnor during their struggle with Angmar. This 'ban' is now only remembered in the Shire and the Breeland as some kind of societal inhibition that Frodo and Butterbur display above. Who knows? I certainly don't...

Anyways, it is always fun to delve into some short passage like this. Thanks for the assignment ;)
 

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