🧙Gandalf the Grey and Gandalf the White

[shadowfax_g]

Do you think there was much diffrence in appearance between Gandalf the Grey and Gandalf the White except his cloths?

I am wondering why Aragorn and co. took such a long time to recognise him. They had some conversation for a while.. couldn't they recognise him after his voice?

Also, Gandalf seemed to have a bit of defect of memory first as he did not call them by names but just Master Elf, Master Dwarf and so on. Was he just playing riddles??

 

[LadyGaladriel]

I have forgotten most things I knew and have remembered some things I forgot

(Basic)


hmmm. aragorn also says :-

What veil was over my sight?

So im guessing that he put a spell over himself so he could see what they would do when they met him

"Well Met"

 

[Gamil Zirak]

You also have to remember that they thought he was dead and didn't expect to run into him any time soon. He caught them off guard. Plus, I'm sure his appearance and wardrobe changed from grey to white.

 

[Xanaphia]

I heard in another thread that Gandalf couldn't die. Wouldn't Aragorn have known that if he was such good friends with Gandalf for so long.

 

[Elias]

I think that Gandalf can die. And I'm sure that Gandalf recognized them in the wood, but he was just playing with them.

You have to remember that they were pretty close to Isengard and they've just spoke about Saruman and if you can remember they saw other old man in the wood before they met Gandalf and Gandalf said that it wasn't him. Of course they thought that Gandalf was dead and with white clothes Gandalf was so different.

And if Gandalf can't die Aragorn would have known that.

 

[Gamil Zirak]

Because he was a Maia, Gandalf's person would not die. However, his physical form could die (i.e. like Suaron).

 

[LadyGaladriel]

they thought he was dead

Yeah ! Thats also a very important factor

 

[Lantarion]

I don't think even Aragorn knew for sure whether Gandalf could actually be killed or not. If the members of the Fellowship had thought he couldn't die then they wouldn't have wept and mourned for him.
And first of all Gandalf was resurrected in a higher status of Maia, meaning that his knowledge, powers and mien were all greatly raised. They might have been naturally struck by awe at the presence of such a powerful (although unseen) power that came from the figure that was Gandalf. And they didn't recognize him at first because he had his grey robes aver him and his hood over his face.
And as for the non-direct names (eg. 'Master Dwarf') I think he may have forgotten them for a while; but I think he wanted to hold up the suspense by not immeidately notifying them of his existence.
A very interesting fact that I just thought of is that when Aragorn blurts out "Gandalf!" when he sees that the figure is him, Gandalf sighs and says something to the effect of "Yes, that was my name." I think he had been in the presence of both Manwë and Ilúvatar, who would have naturally called him Olórin, his true name (this can be contested, if one has read UT, but basically it was his 'true' name), wherefore he would have 'forgotten' his 'Northern' name of Gandalf, and maybe his Elvish name Mithrandir because his whole memory and mind had been swept clean for a while, when his powers were reinstated.

 

[Gil-Galad]

The members of the fellowship didn't know about Gandalf immortality.If they knew,they wouldn't be so despair and sad.
I think Gandalf was white cause he had more power after killing the balrog and he was able to oppose Saruman.It's a kind of uniform I think.Who is wearing white is the strongest,then comes the grey,brown and blue.That's just a suggestion......

 

[shadowfax_g]

I understood Aragorn and co. did not think of Gandalf at once because they were convinced he was dead.
But Gandalf's queer behaviour.. he seemed to be pretending to be Saruman, or at least to try looking ambiguous intentionally. Was he just playing? or he really had forgotten his friend's names??

 

[Gamil Zirak]

You try falling down the pits of Moria with a Balrog. Then when you get to the bottom of your fall, you have to chase the Balrog all the way to the top of the mountain. Once your at the top, you have to fight the Balrog. You defeat the Balrog and through it off the top of the mountain, but (this goes along with my theory that you can't destroy a Maia without being destroyed yourself) your body dies in the process. Well today is your lucky day because you are brought back by the powers that be. So you sit around waiting for an Eagle to come along and take you to Lorien. Once your there you get a brief fill in on what happened to the felloship and then head on to the forest where your buddies are. I don't know about you guys but that can really do some damage to you mentally. Gandalf came back as a new person and had a temporary laps (and can you blame him). That's all that happened. No more. No less. Or that's what I think anyway.

 

[Legolam]

When he was sent back by Iluvatar or Manwe or whatever, I suppose he got a completely new body. Maybe his face differed ever so slightly from Gandalf the Grey's, and this, along with thinking he was dead, was what threw Aragorn and the others?

 

[Niniel]

In the preview for TTT he looked really different from Gandalf the Grey, so if he had changed that much I can imagine they would not recognize him. But he did really behave strange; like the old man that they saw before they met Gandalf: it is never explained who it was. Gandalf says it wasn't him, but why were the horses happy then? Were Gandalf and Saruman both there? Or were the horses happy because Shadowfax was there?

 

[shadowfax_g]

Originally posted by Niniel
In the preview for TTT he looked really different from Gandalf the Grey, so if he had changed that much I can imagine they would not recognize him. But he did really behave strange; like the old man that they saw before they met Gandalf: it is never explained who it was. Gandalf says it wasn't him, but why were the horses happy then? Were Gandalf and Saruman both there? Or were the horses happy because Shadowfax was there?

If the old man was Gandalf with a new body but hadn't totally "recovered" then, it makes sense..
Yet I am not quite sure.

 

[Barahir]

imho, I don't think that he got a 'new' body per se.

It states in the 'tale of years' that:

January 23: Gandalf pursues the Balrog to the peak or Zirakzigil
January 25: He casts down the Balrog, and passes away. His body lies on the peak.
February 14: The Mirror of Galadriel. Gandalf returns to life, and lies in a trance.

Therefore I think that it is indeed the same 'body', but Gandalf has obviously been grated the 'higher' powers/status as Pontifex stated.

 

[shadowfax_g]

Thank you for posting your first post in the forum to my thread, Barahir.

It's an interesting point of view, but how do you think my original question:
"Why did Gandalf behave as if he did not know Aragorn and co.?"

 

[Barahir]

Many thanks shadowfax!!

to answer your question, i agree with pontifex amd gamil as regards the 'trauma' concept as to maybe why he didnt recognise aragorn etc in Fangorn.

After his spirit departing from his body for a period of time, you would have expected a few memory/recollection difficulties, maia or not.

that said, if I remember rightly, he still recognised Gwaihir fast enough when he bore Gandalf to Lothlorien - so there does appear to be slight inconsistency as to Gandalf's powers of memory recollection ;-)

 

[shadowfax_g]

Thanks everyone for interesting inputs.
Honestly still I am not convinced either that Gandalf was just playing or that he got a new body after the deadly damage.. The former is unlike Gandalf, the latter does not explain his too quick memory recovery after Aragorn recognised him. (He did not have any trouble with his memory after that, it's kind of unnatural.)

Probably Gandalf was so shocked by Leglas' pointing him with an arrow that he had forgotten their names instantly.

 

[Niniel]

I still think it's weird that he can telle them everything about how the war is going (which must have been told him by Galadriel?) but that he doesn't seem to remember the names of his former companions, who by the way also play an important role in the war.

 

[shadowfax_g]

I'm sorry but I don't quite follow your last sentence, Niniel.
Which war or battle did you mean?