Is 👁️Sauron a Necromancer?

[Ecthelion]

Is Sauron a Necromacer? I was looking through the Index in the back of The Return of The King and saw 'Necromancer', right next to the word it says 'see Sauron', I never heard of Sauron bieng a Necromancer, so my question is, is Sauron really a Necromancer?

 

[Glomund]

I do not know if he was a necromancer, but in the Hobbit the "Necromancer" was a evil wizard used as a excuse for Gandalf to leave Bilbo and the Dwarves for a while, and he evolved into Sauron as LotR was written

 

[Ithrynluin]

Yes he is. He is skilled in dark sorcery. He knows ways to unnaturally prolong life of mortals (the Ringwraiths, arguably the Mouth of Sauron).

 

[Bombadillo]

yes, sauron was presumably the necromancer mentioned in the hobbit, when the wizards assault the tower in mirkwood, sauron fled and went to Mordor...

 

[Niniel]

Hey Bombadillo
Are there any other wizards that are referred to as Necromancers, anywhere in Tolkien's work?

 

[Brent]

Originally posted by Ecthelion
Is Sauron a Necromacer? I was looking through the Index in the back of The Return of The King and saw 'Necromancer', right next to the word it says 'see Sauron', I never heard of Sauron bieng a Necromancer, so my question is, is Sauron really a Necromancer?

Tolkien doesn't really mean to use the word in its strict sense. Necromancer is a term for the evil presence in Dol Guldor not fortelling the Future by means of the Dead.
And yes Sauron IS THE Necromancer.

 

[BlackCaptain]

A Necromancer is generally someone or something that conjurs spirits of the dead, and performs other magical things for evil use.

With that said, Sauron would be magicaly re-enabling himself since he is planning to take over middle earth again. The first reply also put it good. The white council was held when Gandalf left bilbo and the Dwarves in Mirkwood, and went to drive out the Necromancer from Dul Goldur in south Mirkwood. Tolkien then turned him into Sauron, when he was making his story bigger (LOTR). I assume, that when he was thinking of an enemy, the Necromancer came to mind, and he evolved him into Sauron, and then developed more characters such as Aragorn, the saver of man-kind, Legolas, the son of Thranduil, and Gimli, son of Gloin, all who are essential to the plot.

 

[Bombadillo]

no there isn't but can't I just act like i know something about lotr??

 

[Lantarion]

Hehe Bombadillo.
MorgulKing, a Necromancer, as far as it's name is concerned, refers directly to the reanimating of the dead, and nothing else.
People, please don't try to categorize Tolkien's characters as things like "a Necromancer" or "a Witch" or "a Sorcerer". Apart from being all too D&D-ish, such rigid categories do not exist in Tolkien's world. So there.

 

[10000 strong]

Awesome, I never knew why Gandalf had to leave the hobbits behind, I especially never thought that it would be Sauron that he was going to!!!

 

[BlackCaptain]

When he was writing the Hobbit, I dont think he knew it was Sauron. I dont even think he had any idea who exactly the necromancer was. The Necromancer was kind of an excuse for Gandalf to leave Bilbo and the Dwarves.

So technicaly, he didnt go to Sauron in Dol Guldor, until he had developed his thought more... I think i put that right...

 

[Brent]

Originally posted by Lantarion
Hehe Bombadillo.
MorgulKing, a Necromancer, as far as it's name is concerned, refers directly to the reanimating of the dead, and nothing else.
People, please don't try to categorize Tolkien's characters as things like "a Necromancer" or "a Witch" or "a Sorcerer". Apart from being all too D&D-ish, such rigid categories do not exist in Tolkien's world. So there.

One hates to enter pedant of the year award but Necromancer is one who divines the future by means of the dead, just like a geomancer is one who divines the future by means of the earth and cartomancer is one who divines the future by means of cards.
You don't have to reanimate them, though many famous woodblocks from the 15/16 00's show this.

Couldn't agree more with your second point, though I think D&D pinched ALL their character classes from the characters in Tolkien.

any takers on who is what ?

 

[Úlairi]

The Necromancer of Dol Guldur...

Necromancy: The practice of supposedly communicating with the spirits of the dead in order to predict the future.

Which of the dead would have these inherent qualities? Did Tolkien give any consideration to this? Was the 'gift of foresight' actually given to the Wise by those who were dead? We know that Mandos could certainly see the future, he predicted it many times, and he is in constant contact with the dead. Any opinions?

 

[grendel]

I suspect that he took the word to mean "evil sorcerer" or something like that... it does have an evil sound to it. I didn't realize it had an official definition.

 

[Illuvatar]

Also, keep in mind that he wasn't really a Necromancer after all, he was the most powerful of all the Balrogs and Morgoth's right-hand man

Of old there was Sauron the Maia, whom the Sindar in Beleriand named Gorthaur. In the beginning of Arda Melkor seduced him to his allegiance, and he became the greatest and most trusted of the servants of the Enemy, and the most perilous, for he could assume many forms, and for long if he willed he could still appear noble and beautiful, and so deceive all but the most wary.

--The Silmarillion, pg. 285

 

[Úlairi]

Huh, I really don't know why I bother, but here goes:

The History of Middle-earth XI: The War of the Jewels: The Later Quenta Silmarillion: 15 Of the Ruin of Beleriand and the Fall of Fingolfin: §143
"'Sauron was the chief servant of the evil Vala, whom he had suborned to his service in Valinor from among the people of the gods. He was become a wizard of dreadful power, master of necromancy, foul in wisdom'..."

"...master of necromancy..."

Think that says it all there, so, now we have all the petty stuff out of the way, let's get into the more interesting aspect of the conversation!

 

[nthman]

I'm not sure your definition is entirely accurate. I've always been under the impression that necromancy pertained to any sort of counsultation with the dead and not neccesarily telling the future. I could be wrong though, I'm no expert on the occult. It is a very interesting theory in any case.

 

[Inderjit S]

It is therefore a foolish and perilous thing, besides being a wrong deed forbidden justly by the appointed Rulers of Arda, if the Living seek to commune with the Unbodied, though the houseless may desire it, especially the most unworthy among them. For the Unbodied, wandering in the world, are those what the least have refused the door of life and remain in regret and self-pity. Some are filled with bitterness, grievance, and envy. Some were enslaved by the Dark Lord and do his work still though he himself is gone. They will not speak truth or wisdom. To call on them is folly. To attempt to master them and to make them servants of one own's will is wickedness. Such practices are of Morgoth; and the necromancers are of the host of Sauron his servant.
Some say that the Houseless desire bodies, though they are not willing to seek them lawfully by submission to the judgement of Mandos. The wicked among them will take bodies, if
they can, unlawfully. The peril of communing with them is, therefore, not only the peril of being deluded by fantasies or lies: there is peril also of destruction. For one of the hungry Houseless, if it is admitted to the friendship of the Living, may seek to eject the fëa from its body and in the contest for mastery the body may be gravely injured, even if it he not wrested from its rightful habitant. Or the Houseless may plead for shelter, and if it is admitted, then it will seek to enslave its host and use both his will and his body for its own purposes. It is said that
Sauron did these things, and taught his followers how to achieve them.

LQII; HoME 10

Also, keep in mind that he wasn't really a Necromancer after all, he was the most powerful of all the Balrogs and Morgoth's right-hand man

Sauron was now become a sorcerer of dreadful power...

Of The Ruin of Beleriand

Also, Sauron wasn't a Balrog.

 

[Úlairi]

Was that Later Quenta Inder? 'They do not speak truth or wisdom'. Hmmmm, but they can be used in a sense. This could make a very interesting discussion. Thanks for thre quote Inder.

 

[Illuvatar]

I may be wrong, but in LOTR somewhere, I seem to remember Gandalf saying that the Balrog he slew was the most powerful one, SAVE THE ONE AT THE TOP OF THE DARK TOWER! Unless I'm mistaken, Sauron is the only thing on top of Barad-Dur, unless he had gathered some of the remnants of Morgoth's Balrogs to himself.