Obviously the subtley nuanced intricacies of the script escaped you 🤨I am sort of watching Bionic Showdown: Six Million Dollar Man vs. Bionic Woman. I can see why it wasn't a big hit.🙃
That is one I really need to watch. Such a good film!Watched Lawrence of Arabia today. Absolutely incredible.
Not sure how well this is connected to what you said (which was very insightful, by the way), but I also find characters who are sort of "failed heroes", or not fully successful, very interesting. Paul from Dune is the first I think of. Actually I'm quite sure he was inspired by T.E. Lawrence, I think I read that somewhere. Anyway, I don't think all heroes should be morally ambiguous, since there really are some people who are like Faramir, who really want to do good. But it's also really interesting when you have a character and you don't know if they're going to fail or succeed, like Paul or Lawrence. Where if they do succeed it comes at an extremely high price, and often they're broken by it. I guess I'm kind of just parroting what you said earlier, but yeah, I find that characters who are failed heroes make for very good stories.I just watched the first half of Lawrence of Arabia. and something stood out to me which I just have to share.
It ties into both this film and to Tolkien, and ultimately to characters/stories which are incredible because they resonate, are realistic, are inspiring to a world much in need of a ceertain type of character:
I once heard a discussion (on I believe the Tolkien Lore Podcast years ago) called “Why we need more characters like Faramir”.
In other words, we need more characters who are good/heroic, not because they always makes the right decision (an unrealistic, and thus admired but discouraging character) but because they take the time to think, discuss, weigh wisely, and then follow the right way no matter the cost. Particularly important decisions 1) Either in the future or 2) to the present and decisions which are unclear.
This character type is in opposition to two other characters 1) The stupid, must work through major flaws character (i. e. Faramir in Peter Jackson's movie) Or 2) The character who always seems to do everything right (unrealistically)
Book Faramir, for instance once he captures Frodo and Sam, is unsure of what to do. He talks calmly to them, he treats them kindly and he tells Frodo he must think about the matter. Then he is able to choose wisely. Rather than immediately acting, he is not simply a good character because he does the right thing but he is realistic and encouraging to the reader because he takes the time to find the right way. (Take note - talking to others, seeking advice, in this decision making is majorly important too)
And this stood out to me in Lawrence of Arabia in Lawrence’s character. I do not know if it was historically accurate but, for the sake of storytelling, it was incredible. That is, how much effort they put into the scene as he makes the turning point decision. I believe good stories and characters should be realistic partly for the purpose of being applicable to our lives. And vice versa - by being applicable/realistic it is incredible storytelling.
We need the character that is neither goody-good for no reason or horridly without self-control, seemingly stupid. We need them for they are applicable. we need them for mankind. They are the kinds of characters for role models, for inspiring real people to do good in this world. we need characters who the audience can see are good because they intentionally walk through life, they talk with others, they think, they choice the right paths with intention. Am I not right - does not your spirit soar when you encounter this?
Do you see what I am getting at? I love this conversation.
P.S. I Love the Lord of the Rings film trilogy but this is why I cannot stand Faramir’s portrayal (also Tolkien said if there was anyone in the books he thought he was like it was Faramir. So yes, I could go on a rant)
This could be an excellent discussion for the "What are the signs of a good writer or book for you" thread! https://thetolkien.forum/threads/what-are-the-signs-of-a-good-writer-or-book-for-you.31265/
And now I will go watch the rest of the film. So far, spectacular!!!
Yes! I love what you said. And you got me thinking more. I think this is how what you said is connected:Not sure how well this is connected to what you said (which was very insightful, by the way), but I also find characters who are sort of "failed heroes", or not fully successful, very interesting. Paul from Dune is the first I think of. Actually I'm quite sure he was inspired by T.E. Lawrence, I think I read that somewhere. Anyway, I don't think all heroes should be morally ambiguous, since there really are some people who are like Faramir, who really want to do good. But it's also really interesting when you have a character and you don't know if they're going to fail or succeed, like Paul or Lawrence. Where if they do succeed it comes at an extremely high price, and often they're broken by it. I guess I'm kind of just parroting what you said earlier, but yeah, I find that characters who are failed heroes make for very good stories.
Ooh, I shall have to check it out! I've been listening to the soundtrack for A Great Awakening all week to get me in the mood for the Fourth and stoke the fire in my heart again. 😁 I also really want to go see Angel Studios' new film, Young Washington, which came out this weekend. It looks like it will be really good too, though I think AGA will still hold top spot for me.Just wanted to say, @Fingon_Findekáno, @Glorfindel Goldtress and anyone who enjoyed the A Great Awakening film, I think you would enjoy Amazing Grace (2006). It is similar and very good (though I cannot love it quite as much as the first😅) It is the true story of William Wilberforce. I would recommend it to anyone.
I may be going to see Young Washington. And I love that you were listening to the soundtrack all week. 😄🇺🇸Ooh, I shall have to check it out! I've been listening to the soundtrack for A Great Awakening all week to get me in the mood for the Fourth and stoke the fire in my heart again. 😁 I also really want to go see Angel Studios' new film, Young Washington, which came out this weekend. It looks like it will be really good too, though I think AGA will still hold top spot for me.
Ooh, I'll have to find time to watch this, thank you! The other night I caught the last half hour of a program called The American Miracle: Our Nation Is No Accident on TBN (Trinity Broadcasting Network, a Christian channel on tv). It's a blend of historical moments presented like a movie and commentary from Christian historical experts. It was really good! Wish I could have seen the whole movie.
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