TheManInTheMoon
Member
- Joined
- Aug 25, 2021
- Messages
- 128
Same, kinda. Going to Exile to be oppose your uncle doesn't seem much legitimate for Manwë.I never said anything about murder or killing. I said "revenge". Being his enemy and opposing him in every way is a form of revenge.
Same, kinda. Going to Exile to be oppose your uncle doesn't seem much legitimate for Manwë.
But anyway, as soon as this Galadriel found out about The Curse of Mandos she planned to leave Beleriand and fortify the East. And eventually did so soon. She would've done the same whether Feanor was alive or not. Galadriel is a Mary Sue here in this version. Unlike the other version she doesn't do deeds out of anger here. Her 'opposition' of Feanor here would've been far more peaceful and subtle, unlike the angry goth Galadriel version.
She is, good, at, everything. You forgot her being the excellent pupil of all of the Valar?she's missing a few other key traits such as being good at everything)
She is, good, at, everything. You forgot her being the excellent pupil of all of the Valar?
From the latest version: "being brilliant in mind and swift in action she had early absorbed all of what she was capable of the teaching which the Valar thought fit to give the Eldar,"Uh...yes, actually. Where was that? I don't remember her ever being a smith.
Marginal note against the participants of the second host in the Kinslaying
We don't see Galadriel at all in that chapter, until Helcaraxë. We don't know what was her part in the Kinslaying in that version.
Yes I think that to, Galadriel was supposed to reach to Alqualonde when it was already too late and the battle was over.
Later Tolkien decided to put Galadriel with Fingon and have her turn against Fingon and Feanor in defence of her mother's people. Later he decided that she was already at Alqualonde when Feanor came knocking.
Annals of Aman is Annals of Aman. That Annals of Aman was Christopher's source and he scrapped away that note about Galadriel part in the Kinslaying completely. The way he brutally butchered Turgon by trying to portray him as a sexist who doesn't give any care to his daughter. Chris scrapped away the mention of Idril as the only heir of Turgon in the Flight of the Noldor (can be found in Annals of Aman). And even then Chris failed to properly butcher yet another female characterIt slipped from him to scrap away the mention of Idril as the only heir of Gondolin in a later chapter of published Silmarillion, taken and inserted from Quenta Noldorinwa.
JRR Tolkien: look how my son massacred my girls!
From the latest version: "being brilliant in mind and swift in action she had early absorbed all of what she was capable of the teaching which the Valar thought fit to give the Eldar,"
She was supposed to be only the pupil of two Valar in the earlier versions: "Galadriel was a Noldo, and she had a natural sympathy with their minds and their passionate love of crafts of hand, a sympathy much greater than that found among many of the Eldar: the Dwarves were "the Children of Aulë," and Galadriel, like others of the Noldor, had been a pupil of Aulë and Yavanna in Valinor."
This is why she told Eregion that Annatar Aulendil "was not in the train of Aulë in Valinor". she herself was an Aulendil, yet she didn't remember this Annatar Aulendil from her time back in Valinor.
From the earilest conception, Galadriel was supposed to be the one who enriched Lorien with her skills. The "rustic" Silvan, as Tolkien puts it, weren't that bright, until Galadriel came around. Hence you see Silvan of Lorien are so much more advanced than Silvan of Mirkwood. Their gears are even more advanced than the chief dwelling of the Noldor's.
Yes I think that to, Galadriel was supposed to reach to Alqualonde when it was already too late and the battle was over.
Annals of Aman is Annals of Aman.
That Annals of Aman was Christopher's source and he scrapped away that note about Galadriel part in the Kinslaying completely. ( . . . ) JRR Tolkien: look how my son massacred my girls!
Finrod was explicitly stated to be with Finarfin. To put him into Kinslaying battle, you needed to radically alter the passages about his part in the Rebellion completely.
Yes but it is not stated that they weren't in the Kinslaying in Grey Annals. It is merely stated that they didn't have any part in the slaying of Teleri.all written when Tolkien imagined that these characters were not at the Kinslaying.
Firstly, Galadriel was with Fingolfin's people in the later version. And secondly, indeed Galadriel had no part in kinslaying of Alqualonde. She didn't kill any people of Alqualonde in any versions." . . . because the people of Finarfin had had no part in the Kinslaying of Alqualonde."
She was "the equal if unlike endowments of Feanor". Feanor was a genius who could learn anything which he put his effort into. Same with Galadriel here. Her fall here was her being to genius and knowledge hungry.Well this doesn't necessarily mean she was good at everything,
No you didn't. The information in Of Lembas contradicted this. Until recently people assumed Galadriel taught her maidens how to bake lembas and then from that time on she herself didn't bake anymore. But after NoME got published, we learned that Galadriel didn't teach anyone except her daughter and granddaughter about lembas baking.Hm. I knew she made the lembas (as was the Lady's job).
People of Alqualonde are not Noldor. It's a reference to Teleri.Hm. You don't suppose she killed any Noldor do you? Or even wounded them? Or did she just shield the Teleri from the sharp blades of the Noldor?
Yes but it is not stated that they weren't in the Kinslaying in Grey Annals. It is merely stated that they didn't have any part in the slaying of Teleri.
Look, I know, I understand Tolkien only got Galadriel fighting idea in 1968. The same time he came up with Galadriel being super strong and of a great warrior's stature and skill and all that.
No you didn't. The information in Of Lembas contradicted this. Until recently people assumed Galadriel taught her maidens how to bake lembas and then from that time on she herself didn't bake anymore. But after NoME got published, we learned that Galadriel didn't teach anyone except her daughter and granddaughter about lembas baking.
Did you know Galadriel's mirror is a direct parallel to Irmo's cauldron?
Literally everything in Galadriel's realm is a parallel to something from Undying Lands or Beleriand.
This always gets me: "She had endeavoured to make Lórien a refuge and an island of peace and beauty, a memorial of ancient days, but was now filled with regret and misgiving, knowing that the golden dream was hastening to a grey awakening."
Hm. You don't suppose she killed any Noldor do you? Or even wounded them? Or did she just shield the Teleri from the sharp blades of the Noldor?
She didn't have such desire in the version you are refering to, the Unstained Galadriel version.Did we necessarily get rid of her burning ambition to rule a realm of her own? That CAN be construed as being a flaw.
So...she DID make the Lembas, then?
This Irmo's device doesn't appear in later versions. But its resemblance to The Mirror of Galadriel is quite a nice touch still.Did the Valar even HAVE cauldrons after the stories changed into the Quenta Silmarillion from the Book of Lost Tales? Or did you mean the mirror was a story element that was descended from Irmo's cauldron
I don't recall if they used them. But the parallel here is that Galadriel literally changed the name of Lindorinand into Lorien and Laurolindoranen (sorry for misspelling) just to resemble the name of Irmo's land and Yavanna's Golden Tree. Also, Lorien's other name is associated with dreams and phantoms, again a resemblance to Irmo. Also, Galadriel literally sang to create a forest. Like her teachers before her.I knew the Mallyrn were. Not so much a parallel, though, as they were just FROM Valinor. Did they use Telain in Valinor?
Imagine fighting fiercely/heroically in desperate defence of bunch of not-so-strong-elves against a brutal merciless assault, and you somehow manage to not kill anyone. She did fend off some assaults. In one version she even killed enough to save one ship. I guess in the other version she saved more ships because in the other version she didn't flee in middle of the fight.I realize you might be looking for opinions here, but I'll just add that it's not stated that Galadriel slew anyone in these late ideas. It is not stated that Galadriel ever killed anyone.
Point is: no specific references. Not in any text published to date.
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Are you happy to accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Are you happy to accept cookies and these technologies?