Why do 🐲dragons like, hoard and guard gold?

[esrbl]

Why do they hoard/guard gold?

 

[Erestor Arcamen]

In Greek myth dragons were set by the gods to guard golden treasures. The reason being that dragons were the most fearsome monster and would deter would-be thieves.

The two most famous examples are the Dragon of the Golden Fleece (in the sacred grove of the god Ares), and the Dragon of the Golden Apples (in the sacred grove of the Hesperides).

In Greek drakon (the source for our word dragon) means "the watcher" from drakein the Greek verb meaning to stare.

In Greek legends dragons were also described living in the mountains of India where they guarded the sources of gold. Sometimes instead of dragons, the guardians were griffins or giant ants. But in every case, the creature simply represented something which was fearsome and made acquisition of the riches difficult.

Source: lotr subreddit:

 

[Olorgando]

Interestingly, there are not that many dragons mentioned in Norse / Anglo-Saxon sagas. There is the one that Beowulf faces at the end of his life, and Fafnir of the Völsunga saga which was also used as a part of the later German Nibelungenlied. I'll ignore the "Miðgarðsormr", that titanic sea serpent who encircles the world and is more an elemental force.

Apparently there is a tradition in Norse sagas / mythology that dragons guarding hoards weren't dragons in origin, but misers hoarding riches, and that this trait then caused them to turn into dragons (I'll take a guess that my usual suspect Tom Shippey wrote something about this).

 

[Squint-eyed Southerner]

Somewhere here there's a thread where I brought up derkomai, the transfixing stare of the dragon, most evident in Glaurung (though apparent in Smaug also), of which drakon seems to be a derivative.

Erestor's quote raises a question in my mind about the origins of the ancient connection of gold and dragons: besides sight, which we know the Greeks considered an active, rather than passive, function, derkomai also meant "flash" or "gleam", terms long associated with gold; indeed, throughout the history of myth and literature, the "flash and gleam" of gold has attracted, even transfixed, the eyes of countless heroes and villains. I wonder if that might be what connected the two in the minds of the ancients? Hmm. . . 🤔

BTW, lest I be thought too "Greco-centric", I'll point out that derkomai is cognate with a Sanskrit word that I won't even attempt to reproduce.

 

[Elthir]

Wow! Great answers!

I was going to say 'cause Dragons are cool.

 

[Olorgando]

I was going to say 'cause Dragons are cool.

"Cool" and their high-temperature "bad breath"?
I see massive contradictions in such an assessment ...

 

[Squint-eyed Southerner]

Of course dragons are cool!

 

[Elthir]

Concerning Bonnie (Ross Geller's new girlfriend)

Rachel "You said she was bald!"
Phoebe: "Was . . . was was was was was!"

But yes, Dragons are cool anyway 🐾

 

[Squint-eyed Southerner]

Yeah, Man -- 'cause they like, hoard gold 'n stuff!

 

[Elthir]

And wicked cool in Boston MA.

But back to the topic: technically Gwaihir should be spelled Gwaehir, but as even Tolkien used the former . . .

 

[Olorgando]

Guys, I am unable to follow "Sindarin vs. Quenya" discussions, or whatever trend some threads here seem to be drifting into …

 

[Erestor Arcamen]

Somewhere here there's a thread where I brought up derkomai, the transfixing stare of the dragon, most evident in Glaurung (though apparent in Smaug also), of which drakon seems to be a derivative.

Erestor's quote raises a question in my mind about the origins of the ancient connection of gold and dragons: besides sight, which we know the Greeks considered an active, rather than passive, function, derkomai also meant "flash" or "gleam", terms long associated with gold; indeed, throughout the history of myth and literature, the "flash and gleam" of gold has attracted, even transfixed, the eyes of countless heroes and villains. I wonder if that might be what connected the two in the minds of the ancients? Hmm. . . 🤔

BTW, lest I be thought too "Greco-centric", I'll point out that derkomai is cognate with a Sanskrit word that I won't even attempt to reproduce.

You mean the dragon in LOTR? 😬

 

[Squint-eyed Southerner]

Don't remind me!

 

[Erestor Arcamen]

Don't remind me!

You started it 😋

Also, here is a thread that discussed dragons and treasure further

https://thetolkien.forum/threads/why-does-smaug-prefer-maidens.28531/

 

[Elthir]

Guys, I am unable to follow "Sindarin vs. Quenya" discussions, or whatever trend some threads here seem to be drifting into …

Both are Sindarin, but Gwaihir is purposely spelled wrong, like Aiglos instead of Aeglos for another example (IIRC). So in a sense the -ai- version here isn't "wrong" since Tolkien himself employed it . . . it's more like I had too much time on my hands this afternoon.

🐾

 

[Olorgando]

Both are Sindarin, ...

See? See? I can't even follow that! 🥴

 

[Elthir]

See? See? I can't even follow that! 🥴

Actually since I've been going on memory here (and we saw what happened with Biffle and Bomble), I must confess that I can't recall if Tolkien "purposely" used -ai- in Gwaihir when the phonology required -ae- . . . or whether the phonology changed after the publication of The Lord of the Rings.

Or something else. Ahem. Anyway the spellings for these names end up as Gwaehir, Aeglos, and Maedros. And since I can't even follow my own post, Ando is rightfully cutting me off in mid . . .

 

[Olorgando]

Following ElthirAndo's dysfunctional "interaction" is hardly any better than Sindarin / Quenya philology!
I must take countermeasures, like adopting a secret identity of my own. What a Gotham City billionaire playboy and some guy from an inert gas planet can do … you get my drift.
I've been mulling over "Oloranto" as an alias ... not sure that it may bee too obvious, gives too much away … I'll get back to you about this. 🤔

 

[Elthir]

May I suggest Gandolor, thus Gando for short 😇

 

[Squint-eyed Southerner]

Orlando!