For a final informative view for Khamul

[norrinradd]

Have as in "own"?

It would be awesome if you asked me the page number and didn't have access to the book

Anyway, I know I fool around sometimes, but this next bit is true: my old cameras no longer have "living" batteries, and I don't own a phone outside of a landline.

🐾

What reference was being made when using the term “from the East?

 

[Elthir]

And here I thought I was the last living 🦕

😁 My mail carrier 🏇


norrinradd wrote: What reference was being made when using the term “from the East?

Page 84. Entry "Nine he gave to Mortal Men" (edit for brevity) "One of the Nine, Khamul, commander of Dol Guldur, was from the East; see further, The Hunt For The Ring in Unfinished Tales."

Also, the pages are actually "creamier" than I joked about.

 

[norrinradd]

😁 My mail carrier 🏇


norrinradd wrote: What reference was being made when using the term “from the East?

Page 84. Entry "Nine he gave to Mortal Men" (edit for brevity) "One of the Nine, Khamul, commander of Dol Guldur, was from the East; see further, The Hunt For The Ring in Unfinished Tales."

Also, the pages are actually "creamier" than I joked about.

Hi elthir, I hope it doesn't bother anyone that I'm posting in this thread again. Do you have a chance to convey the information about Khamul on the 2 pages in the book which I mentioned below? Unfortunately I do not have this book.

Wayne G. Hammond/ Christina Scull, The Lord of the Rings: A Reader’s Companion, “Many Meetings”, page 204-205

 

[Elthir]

Hi. There aren't any references to K. on these pages. At least not in my edition

 

[norrinradd]

Hi. There aren't any references to K. on these pages. At least not in my edition

Thanks your attention.

In addition; I emailed Wayne Hammond and Christina Scull and they allowed me to share their opinions, which I quoted below:

“Khamûl does seem to have been an Easterling, or Man from the East of Middle-earth, whatever that may have meant in Tolkien's mythology in terms of race, ethnicity, or customs. Tolkien provides only scanty information, calling him in one version of The Hunt for the Ring 'the second to the Chief, Khamûl the Shadow of the East', and in another, rejected version (as you saw), though unnamed, 'the Second Chief (the Black Easterling)'. 'The Black Easterling' of course is only another way of saying 'the Shadow of the East', black and shadow referring to a dark evil rather than to, say, skin colour.
Best wishes,
Wayne Hammond & Christina Scull”

In addition again, Carl F. Hostetter, who is editor of The Nature of The Middle-Earth, wrote me just quoted below via email when he considered together both epithets of Khamûl (Shadow of the East and Black Easterling - even if BE rejected passage):
“I see no reason whatsoever to think that Tolkien ever “rejected” the idea that Khamûl was an Easterling — i.e., a man from and/or ruling in the east of Middle-earth. I’m unsure why anyone would think otherwise.
Carl”


And Mark Fisher, who is owner of Encyclopedia of Arda wrote me just quoted below:
“The reason for rewriting this text might have had nothing to do with Khamûl at all, so I don't think we can take it for granted that the 'Black Easterling' title was definitively rejected by Tolkien. Perhaps he simply preferred 'Shadow of the East'. In either case, I'd say the natural presumption would be that he imagined Khamûl as coming from the East. (It would be rather odd to imagine him changing his mind on this point, and then choosing 'Shadow of the East' as a title.)”

Although I know that some forum members are uncomfortable with my constant writing on this topic but I think it is correct to convey the views and information of important authors/ thinkers to all forum members or readers/ searchers without being forum member. Best.