Sindarin Tattoo Translation request 🙂🙏

[Tûrwethiel]

Hi there, mellyn! 🙂
I'm looking for help and guidance from this community regarding writing in the Sindarin language. The idea is that - I want to get a tattoo with the phrase "Follower of the star" or "Follow the star" in Sindarin.

After conducting some research using open dictionaries, mostly this, I found that it might be like this:

• “Follower of the star" - “Aphadon en êl”
• “Follow the star" - “Aphad i êl“. I also received advice for this variant, that I need to use ”aphado” instead “aphad”, cause "follow" need to be conjugated in the imperative tense mood, aphado, otherwise it's more like "follows the star”.

And one more question, it is possible to use word “elen” that means star on Sindarin or better stick to the êl?

I would greatly appreciate your input and thoughts on this matter. Thank you so much! 😊

 

[Squint-eyed Southerner]

Welcome, Turwethiel! 🙂

We have some language experts, but you may need to be patient until they swing by.

 

[Elthir]

I'd use êl, and then you could echo such Tolkienian examples like Narn en·Êl "Tale of the Star", or Narn e·Dant Gondolin ar Orthad en·Êl -- which seems to end with " . . . Rising of the Star".

Anyway, I'm not a Tolkien language expert . . . but if you've any questions about napping. . .

In The War of the Jewels Tolkien wrote: "êl, pl. elin, class plural elenath. An archaic word for "star", little used except in verse, apart from the form elenath "all the host of the stars of heaven".

 

[Squint-eyed Southerner]

I too can offer napping advice.

 

[Elthir]

I have a friend working on an
answer at this very moment!

Apologies. I'm guessing you're
seeing responses, clicking here,
and finding cats and dogs instead.

I blame me!

In any case, in The Road Goes Ever On (published by JRRT himself in 1967) Tolkien stated that the more usual word for “star” in ordinary speech was gil.

For another option, possibly.

 

[Gilruin]

“Follower of the star" - “Aphadon en êl”

That works, as Elthir correctly pointed out, we have a very similar example with narn en·êl ‘tale of the star’. Also just like he said gil is also an option, with that it becomes aphadon e·ngil (with special case ᵑg mixed mutation).

“Follow the star" - “Aphad i êl“. I also received advice for this variant, that I need to use ”aphado” instead “aphad”, cause "follow" need to be conjugated in the imperative tense mood, aphado, otherwise it's more like "follows the star”.

I cannot think of a context where this would be anything else than the imperative aphado i·êl to be honest. It’s hard to get that intuition from English sometimes, because the imperative is not specially marked there, but when I try in German, my native language, only the imperative version sounds sensible. Also note that aphad i·êl would be a perfectly fine way to express ‘(s)he follows the star’ in a declarative sentence, Sindarin doesn’t need a subject pronoun here. With gil it would become aphado i·ngil (variously spelt i·ñil or i·ŋil to get the point across that there is no real pronounced g here, just n-like sound in sing, bring).

And one more question, it is possible to use word “elen” that means star on Sindarin or better stick to the êl?

It can’t really be elen in Sindarin proper. The word starts out as primitive Elvish ★elen, pl. elenī and Quenya gets elen, pl. eleni from that but the Sindarin development is more involved: there is a period in Sindarin’s history when final -n is lost, so the singular form becomes ele, while the plural stays elenī the same, because there the n is protected by the plural ī. Then the ī in the plural shifts the vowels around a bit and then final vowels are lost and monosyllables are lengthened, and that’s how we get to Sindarin êl, pl. elin.

​

Singular: ★elen > ele > el > êl​

Plural: ★elenī > eleni > elini > elin​

​

However in Parma Eldalamberon 17, p. 67 Tolkien mentioned that Sindarin developed an analogical plural elen from the plural elin and the class plural elenath, based on the pattern of words like lalven ‘elm-tree’, pl. lelvin, class plural *lalvenath, which was perceived to be more regular.

 

[Tûrwethiel]

That works, as Elthir correctly pointed out, we have a very similar example with narn en·êl ‘tale of the star’. Also just like he said gil is also an option, with that it becomes aphadon e·ngil (with special case ᵑg mixed mutation).

I cannot think of a context where this would be anything else than the imperative aphado i·êl to be honest. It’s hard to get that intuition from English sometimes, because the imperative is not specially marked there, but when I try in German, my native language, only the imperative version sounds sensible. Also note that aphad i·êl would be a perfectly fine way to express ‘(s)he follows the star’ in a declarative sentence, Sindarin doesn’t need a subject pronoun here. With gil it would become aphado i·ngil (variously spelt i·ñil or i·ŋil to get the point across that there is no real pronounced g here, just n-like sound in sing, bring).


It can’t really be elen in Sindarin proper. The word starts out as primitive Elvish ★elen, pl. elenī and Quenya gets elen, pl. eleni from that but the Sindarin development is more involved: there is a period in Sindarin’s history when final -n is lost, so the singular form becomes ele, while the plural stays elenī the same, because there the n is protected by the plural ī. Then the ī in the plural shifts the vowels around a bit and then final vowels are lost and monosyllables are lengthened, and that’s how we get to Sindarin êl, pl. elin.

​

Singular: ★elen > ele > el > êl​

Plural: ★elenī > eleni > elini > elin​

​

However in Parma Eldalamberon 17, p. 67 Tolkien mentioned that Sindarin developed an analogical plural elen from the plural elin and the class plural elenath, based on the pattern of words like lalven ‘elm-tree’, pl. lelvin, class plural *lalvenath, which was perceived to be more regular.

Thank you so much! ❤️
After using all these online dictionaries and other resources, my head was in such a mess. When I realized that I couldn't click on the tabs in my browser because there were too many open, I understood that I might need help. 🙈😂
And yeah, dealing with the imperative was such a mess because my native language, which is Ukrainian, is pretty clear, but English is another beast entirely.))

I am super thankful to you for the time and effort you put into the answer! 🙏 It sheds light on the matter and reduces my stress about my future tattoo.
I hope everything will be okay with it, and I will post a picture of the tattoo after it's done!

 

[Tûrwethiel]

I have a friend working on an
answer at this very moment!

Apologies. I'm guessing you're
seeing responses, clicking here,
and finding cats and dogs instead.

I blame me!

In any case, in The Road Goes Ever On (published by JRRT himself in 1967) Tolkien stated that the more usual word for “star” in ordinary speech was gil.

For another option, possibly.

It was perfect! 😂 I checked some of the topics with dogs here)) Well, what can I say, it is my next step to look at dogs in LORT ^^
Funny, I am a dog owner and I have never thought about dogs and cats 🤔

 

[Squint-eyed Southerner]