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The Lord of the Rings: The Rings of Power – Teaser Trailer

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Who said anything about racism Mr Numbers? Oh, yes, you just did. The only ones trying to 'cancel' anything around here are you who can't even give this project a chance and just have to spend so much of your time tearing it down. What a sad existence. Oh well. So what happened to the Russian cyberbot posting all the conspiracy stuff? At least their posts were fun to read.
OK Mr Alsatian, we appear to have been given the green light for nick abuse. Congratulations!
I have no interest whatsoever in your childish YT votes, nor your ranting and whingeing about them, nor the childish output from Amazon.
I wonder why you defend them so - do you have shares?
Please try and make a coherent point for once if that is within your capabilities.
Don't be shy, @Erestor Arcamen is currently liking posts from both of us!
 
I'm not, for whatever that's worth- but neither are many of the other members here, in case you hadn't noticed. I'm seeing childish behavior from more than one source.

It's possible to disagree without insults. If this continues, another thread will have to be closed.
 
Gando, they are probably wise in not making any commentary as it only feeds this slagger cult. I really wonder what they all are so afraid of.
My guess goes more in the direction that it's part of the agreement they reached with Amazon for the television rights.
And that they keep out of such frays as a matter of principle. Christopher's harrumphs about PJ's LoTR films were few - and the film rights had been sold decades earlier.
Where I severely disagree with you is your implication (as I interpret it) that all those dumping on the Jeff Bezos company are from "the wrong corner", to translate a term familiar in Germany. These may be getting the most attention, by "virtue" of their pushing "hot buttons" and yelling the loudest. There are enough things in that one-minute trailer to make one - me - want to use John McEnroe's most famous quote, "you cannot be serious", in Amazon's direction. As to Amazon's real-life "dedication" to diversity and inclusiveness, Ealdwyn posted enough links in another thread to expose anything Amazon does in this direction as a form of greenwashing.
What I can't get my head around is that Amazon apparently thought they could somehow silence critics with that "superfan" stunt. There are plenty of "superfans" here on TTF, but those four wouldn't last a minute in any discussion on JRRT's works here on TTF. I feel pity for them for their having been manipulated by Amazon in this way; they voiced some valid grievances, but Amazon a "champion" for such causes? Gimme a break!
 
I'm not, for whatever that's worth- but neither are many of the other members here, in case you hadn't noticed. I'm seeing childish behavior from more than one source.

It's possible to disagree without insults. If this continues, another thread will have to be closed.
It's pretty clear that this thread went south quite early on! I wouldn't mourn its loss one bit.

And I did complain about the nick abuse, but apparently that is acceptable now - not my decision!
 
What I can't get my head around is that Amazon apparently thought they could somehow silence critics with that "superfan" stunt. There are plenty of "superfans" here on TTF, but those four wouldn't last a minute in any discussion on JRRT's works here on TTF. I feel pity for them for their having been manipulated by Amazon in this way; they voiced some valid grievances, but Amazon a "champion" for such causes? Gimme a break!
Whether we agree with the "Superfans" or not, that is how they earn a living, it is the way of the world now. I see no point dumping on them (except to have a laff) since Amazon is paying them to do it. I wouldn't expect anyone to turn down the sort of money that I assume Amazon is paying them - after all, if they don't do the gig, someone else will.
 
Whether we agree with the "Superfans" or not, that is how they earn a living, it is the way of the world now. I see no point dumping on them (except to have a laff) since Amazon is paying them to do it. I wouldn't expect anyone to turn down the sort of money that I assume Amazon is paying them - after all, if they don't do the gig, someone else will.
Hmyes; the guy who took the part of moderator introduced the other three as "a Fellowship of Influencers". (BTW my spellchecker does not seem to be familiar with the term "Influencer" - yet 🤣 ). That's a segment of the Internet that I am wholly unfamiliar with. But them I am anything but a surfer (the vast majority of my time online has been spent in JRRT forums; Wikipedia probably comes next). I guess I would say I slosh around in the shallows, at best ankle-deep. 😷
What continues to fascinate me how @Squint-eyed Southerner , using a tiny smart-phone no less, and having by his own admission gone online with that almost two years after I did, digs up stuff apparently all over the place. The fitting comparison might be Gandalf or Aragorn to my Hobbit - if not quite The Gaffer, then at most Merry pre-quest, who at least seemed familiar with Bree. 😬
 
Anyway, I found this interesting article on the 'diversity' issue.
Unfortunately, the article is full of lies and false information. I'd gladly go into it, if this had not already been discussed here or in other threads, or if it weren't self-explanatory to anyone familiar with Tolkien and with a modicum of common sense left.

Only that much:
In any case, the idea that people of color were not part of Britain or Northern Europe in the ancient and medieval past is false.
This is just complete nonsense. In the Middle Ages, the amount of PoC in Europe was less than 0.0001% in rural areas and less than 0.1% in cities. Every reasonably educated European knows that: Yes, there have been some PoCs in Europe, but that was an absolute exception and completely rare, especially in rural areas. And most people lived in small villages or single farms back in the Middle Ages. Even if more and more articles by woke activists are popping up that claim the opposite: This is simply fake news and propagandalf 🧙‍♂️ uh... propaganda.

In antique metropolises, which were more diverse, such as ancient Rome, there may have been a slightly higher proportion of PoC, but even there the proportion of African descent is unlikely to have been more than 2%, and these were usually either slaves, freedmen, gladiators, or mercenaries.
In ancient times, before the Middle Ages, there were larger cities especially in southern Europe, which were culturally more developed than the northern celtic and germanic tribes, and which conducted a lot of trade with other countries. So there was definitely more "diversity" than during the Middle Ages, but that still has nothing in common with the casting decisions of modern series. Of course, there were more tanned people in the south, first of all because it's naturally much warmer there than in northern Europe, but there was also a cultural and economic exchange, especially in the Mediterranean region with Asia Minor and northern Africa like Egypt.
But also in North Africa (near the coasts of the Mediterranean Sea) there were (and are) not many PoC with dark skin according to today's terms, but rather the "Mediterranean" type. And it's very, very certain that Tolkien, in his descriptions of dark or brown skin, meant that Mediterranean skin type when he spoke of Dunlendings, Gondorians (who were not of Numenorean ancestry) or the people of Near(!)-Harad including the natives at Umbar.

Another problem with the series is that the cast is not really diverse in the true sense of the word. For a series set in the Second Age, for example, I'd have expected a storyline in the East (Rhun), too. Where are the Asian-looking actors in the cast? They don't exist. The sole purpose here is to depict the social conditions of modern US cities, which for me personally, as a European who is not "woke" or completely left-leaning, destroys the immersion from the start. But for an American who is not familiar with European mythology and history, this probably may not matter.

For me (and I'm obviously not alone in this), in any case, it's a form of cultural appropriation. I don't want to see white Europeans playing Africans in the "Black Panther" cast either. And I don't want to see PoC or white swordsmen in main roles in Asian fantasy/Wuxia movies like "Hero" either, just to meet some quota or because these fools think you can only identify with characters who have the same skin color as you. Because that's the real racism. Immersion works through authenticity, not skin color or minority quotas. Otherwise, I'd also have to be upset that left-handed people and people who wear glasses are underrepresented, for example.I want an authentic, exciting, immersive story - and not to be represented by actors who wear glasses or are left-handed. However, if a character is explicitly described as left-handed or wearing glasses in the original / book, it should not be the opposite in the film adaptation. I hope that such banal examples will make the problem a little clearer to some people...

----

By the way, here's some more "funny" information about the "superfans":

 
Wow... somebody is sore. I wasn't being nasty about the cute name but you sure took it that way. Oh well. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Me, I'm all for seeing what is presented in September and will post my thoughts on it then. There is no point in engaging further with all you who have already decided that this adaptation sucks no matter what. Enjoy each other.

:cool:
 
Me, I'm all for seeing what is presented in September and will post my thoughts on it then. There is no point in engaging further with all you who have already decided that this adaptation sucks no matter what. Enjoy each other.

I'd certainly understand your attitude if there weren't already so many "red flags". But maybe your tolerance level here is inversely proportional to the nickname tolerance level of "m4rNumbers" (Well, wasn't that already a small compromise?)
 
I'd certainly understand your attitude if there weren't already so many "red flags". But maybe your tolerance level here is inversely proportional to the nickname tolerance level of "m4rNumbers" (Well, wasn't that already a small compromise?)
Inverse ... My high tolerance of actually trying to engage here amongst all the repetition of series-bashing posts to my low tolerance of a netspeak name? Gotcha.

Edit because that or the next post isn't worth its own reply. The next post will say 'We" and "realistic". Yes, the Hobbit stunk. I still gave it the chance it deserved and didn't write it off because a bunch of internet fools campaigned so hard against it for months and even years saying it isn't 'true' Tolkien. No, The Hobbit movie franchise will never 'improve' because some other adaptation of a totally different nature comes along. Will this series suck? It might. It might not. We... or I, at least, will see. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ GFY
Emfourarethirtyfiveenthreefiftyseven (I believe that is correct), you assume so much. If you bothered to read anything I've posted outside than this thread, you would have seen I have said it many times. Also, I am, and have been a fan of the books for a very long time, so don't try claiming the high ground with me with your general 'book fans' crap. OYCF2.
 
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Wow... somebody is sore. I wasn't being nasty about the cute name but you sure took it that way. Oh well. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Me, I'm all for seeing what is presented in September and will post my thoughts on it then. There is no point in engaging further with all you who have already decided that this adaptation sucks no matter what. Enjoy each other.

:cool:
We are merely being realistic. People had been warning that the Hobbit will suck, and it turned out to be true. And by the looks of it, Rings of Power will make the Hobbit look like a masterpiece by comparison.
 
Wow... somebody is sore. I wasn't being nasty about the cute name but you sure took it that way. Oh well. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Don't assume people like strangers being "cute" with their names. It is just basic respect! I wasn't expecting to have to point that out.
Me, I'm all for seeing what is presented in September and will post my thoughts on it then. There is no point in engaging further with all you who have already decided that this adaptation sucks no matter what. Enjoy each other.
:cool:
Well if you had just said that in the first place instead of bringing all that irrelevant "smoke & mirrors", political buzzword nonsense into the fray, things would have been a lot less fraught.

In the interests of sane discussion, I cannot see (mathematically - they are using about 5% of virtually nothing) any way for Amazon can make this a worthwhile experience for fans of Tolkien's books. You obviously have some hope that many of us simply cannot understand, perhaps you would like to give us some idea what this is based on!

I'd certainly understand your attitude if there weren't already so many "red flags". But maybe your tolerance level here is inversely proportional to the nickname tolerance level of "m4rNumbers" (Well, wasn't that already a small compromise?)
Grow up Anna.

Some blather.
OK I have tried to bury the hatchet, but you are obviously a complete waste of time & space.
 
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I totally dislike this trailer....and i fear the worst, i am very disappointed of this trailer. I think, the amazon producers use Tolkiens Name, but what they produce there has nothing in common with the Silmarillion or others of Tolkiens books.
Strange man with wings, a naked man which falls from heaven in a meteor and a forced diversity cast...that is not Tolkiens middle earth. And i totally dislike how they show Galadriel...as warrior princess with a sword, chasing orks. That is not Tolkiens wise, pretty Galadriel. I will not watch the series, because it has no middle earth feeling for me....
Black Elves....like the black Lord in "Bridgerton" (a black Lord in the 19th century England although they didnt have black people in aristocraty that time) that is a typical example for forced diversity cast in our days, and it destroy every historic and fantasy serie.
Why they didnt use black actors to play the Harad, which was black in Tolkiens books?
i am not a racist, but i cant accept black elves, that fits not to my imagination of elves.
I mean, they would never use a white actor for playing Kunta Kinte in "Roots", but they use black people to play elves and in case of "Bridgerton" a Lord in the England of the 19th century. That is totally absurd and another reason(one of a lot of reasons) for me to not watch this serie.
 
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I totally dislike this trailer....and i fear the worst, i am very disappointed of this trailer. I think, the amazon producers use Tolkiens Name, but what they produce there has nothing in common with the Silmarillion or others of Tolkiens books.
Strange man with wings, a naked man which falls from heaven in a meteor and a forced diversity cast...that is not Tolkiens middle earth. And i totally dislike how they show Galadriel...as warrior princess with a sword, chasing orks. That is not Tolkiens wise, pretty Galadriel. I will not watch the series, because it has no middle earth feeling for me....
Yeah...this feels like generic high fantasy to me.
Black Elves....like the black Lord in "Bridgerton" (a black Lord in the 19th century England although they didnt have black people in aristocraty that time) that is a typical example for forced diversity cast in our days, and it destroy every historic and fantasy serie.
It would be different if they were from a different region that made sense (like Harad, as you said, or the Sun Lands) but as is it's rather inexplicable. Also, where did all of these black characters GO in the Third Age? Heck, it even makes sense to make the Numenoreans darker-skinned since they've lived on the equator for thousands of years.
I mean, they would never use a white actor for playing Kunta Kinte in "Roots", but they use black people to play elves and in case of "Bridgerton" a Lord in the England of the 19th century. That is totally absurd and another reason(one of a lot of reasons) for me to not watch this serie.
My favourite is the black Anne Boleyn. Sidenote, what is all of this subtly saying? Black characters are only good when they're repurposed from white characters? Why aren't they making movies or shows based on African folklore? It's almost like they're saying "Your stuff isn't good enough; here, have our leftovers".
 
Heck, it even makes sense to make the Numenoreans darker-skinned since they've lived on the equator for thousands of years.
However, this is not true, since Arda was still a disk before Numenor's demise and thus the solar intensity was nearly the same everywhere. Temperature differences between the different countries cannot be explained physically, but rather by the influence of the Valar. Only after Arda was formed into a sphere, the proximity to the equator may have played a role.

Also from the description of the island of Numenor it is clear that it was created completely according to the will of the Valar and had rather moderate climate.

This is explained among other things also again in the following very good video, where the self-proclaimed "Tolkien professor" Corey Olsen is exposed again as a liar and quite clueless pseudo expert.
The Youtuber "Just some guy" generally makes many very good videos about Tolkien and the current "wokification". And by the way, he is not the only known black Youtuber who is a Tolkien fan and at the same time stands up for book fidelity, also concerning skin colors. For me, this is further proof that the vast majority of people don't have racist ulterior motives when it comes to this kind of criticism, but rather that they are concerned with immersion and fidelity to Tolkien's work.

 
However, this is not true, since Arda was still a disk before Numenor's demise and thus the solar intensity was nearly the same everywhere. Temperature differences between the different countries cannot be explained physically, but rather by the influence of the Valar. Only after Arda was formed into a sphere, the proximity to the equator may have played a role.
True, I suppose. They ARE implied to be similar to ancient Mediterraneans, at least. Judging by their artist choices and symbolic connection to the story of Atlantis..
Númenórean helmet, by J.R.R. Tolkien.jpg
 
True, I suppose. They ARE implied to be similar to ancient Mediterraneans, at least. Judging by their artist choices and symbolic connection to the story of Atlantis..
In the first scene you can see a port of Numenor. I think the design of the city is okay. It's strongly reminiscent of the ancient Greeks, from whom (via Plato and Egypt) the legend of Atlantis originated. I think Tolkien also confirmed a few times (in letters etc.) that there were - purely culturally - similarities between the Numenorians and Ancient Egypt and other ancient peoples in the Mediterranean region. For example, the preference for imposing and colossal buildings and statues.

I assume that they will definitely implement this more or less correctly in the series. However, unfortunately, you have to expect that the cast will be random-diverse in an absurd way - as is unfortunately common in every modern fantasy series today. So the king will be white, the queen black, the first child white, the second black, the third oriental.... Only (East) Asians are strangely not in the main cast at all.
 
I'd say it's a Mannish tradition that the world was once flat. In the Elvish (Western Elvish) tradition the world was always round. Thus these Western Elves thus tried to teach the Numenoreans thusly:

"And behold! the fashion of the Earth is such that a girdle may be set about it. Or as an apple it hangeth on the branches of Heaven, and it is round and fair, and the seas and lands are but the rind of the fruit, which shall abide upon the tree until the ripening that Eru hath appointed."

JRRT, The Drowning of Anadune
 
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