What would happen if 🧙Saruman got the ring?

[Harad]

running out of fingers

Those sound like good arguments that the Ringwraiths didnt have rings--kinda makes them misnomers, tho.

Sauron, not having form, you might argue, didnt have fingers, but with the 9 for men, and the assorted dwarf rings he had, and having lost a finger to Isildur, he must be using virtual fingers if he is "wielding" the Rings.

originally from Buck-meister
Would the Nazgul follow Saruman if he had the Ring? I'm not so sure. Isn't Sauron wearing their 9 rings? (where'd I read that?) Would that make Sauron subject to Saruman? He'd probably just take them off. But, on the Nazgul thing, their will is so bound to Sauron that neither of them need to wear their ringsanymore to be slaves to his will.

Whether or not Sauron is "wearing" the other rings wouldnt matter, since those rings were "Men" or "Dwarf" rings. Sauron probably could not be controlled thru them.

The Nazgul have sold themselves to Sauron thru the Rings. However, in their roles as servants to the biggest Evil thing around, I see no reason why they would not switch sides to a new RingLord, since it would be just a matter of time before the new RingLord gathered the other rings to himself.

As far as Sauron himself, maybe he could get back into the role of second fiddle, altho seeing Saruman as the second coming of Morgoth might be more than he could stomach.

 

[daisy]

What I've also never quite understood is why the Nazgul would hand over the ring to Sauron if they became holders of it. For instance, if they had been able to get the ring off of Frodo during the Flight to the Ford, or at Weathertop, would they have just ridden it back to Mordor and given it to Sauron willingly? And if so, why and how? If they truly lusted after the one ring, could sense it were drawn to it blah blah, why would they just give it up? Why not become Dark Lords thmselves and they would fight and then the Nazgul King would probably win etc....

So...wha's up?

daisy the confused crocus...

 

[StewardDenethor]

I'm not sure that the Nazgul crave after the Ring, as much as they are simply drawn to it as it is master of the Nine. Since Sauron wields those rings, they would then be summoned back to Mordor by his will, just as they were guided by his will throughout LOTR. He seems able to control them by thought while he has the Nine (look at the way they sped to Mount Doom when Sauron became aware of Frodo.)

 

[Bucky]

Daisy: The reason the Nazgul would bring the Ring back to Sauron is that they are totally bound to his will.
They don't even need to wear the rings to exist permanently in the wraith-world. Or to be bound to Sauron's will.
Would Saron have sent them if he even doubted?

Harad: I firmly believe Sauron has a shape in the Third Age.
Gollum says 'He only has 4 fingers on one hand, but that is enough".
Also Tolkien states in Appendix B 'Sauron begins to take shape'.
And on the rings being for Men or Dwarves, I think that they just happened to be given to them. Tolkien states that they rings gave power & gifting according to the original nature of the being possesing them (Gandalf in 'The Shadow of the Past').
The Elves certainly didn't make them FOR Men & Dwarves, Sauron took them & then used them to his best advantage. Only the 3 were specifically for the Elves.


Grond:
>>> Sauruman as a Maia should be more closely attuned to
the powers of the OneRing than any of the Elves who
claimed they could use it if they wanted to (a claim never
demonstrated).

But weren't the secrets to the Rings of Power a collaberation of the Noldorian Elves of Hollin & Sauron ?
And, Celebrimbor, who created The Three himself, was aware of Sauron when he put on The One, so he must have been 'tuned' to the right frequency, if you will.....

If it's a matter of 'power' there seems to be evidence to indicate that High Elves would have that.....

How about several instances where High Elves were a match for Balrogs (of the Order of Maiar) in the Fall of Gondolin?
Isn't it said Ecthelion & Gothmog (Lord of the Balrogs & High Captain of Angband) 'slew each other'?
And, Glorfindel & the Balrog who 'both fell to ruin in an abyss'?

I certainly think Galadriel, High Elf & princess of the House of Finwe, would have the power or 'attunement' to use the One Ring.

 

[Harad]

Bucky:
Sauron made MANY mistakes. Trusting the Nazgul if someone else like Saruman wielded the OneRing would have been another mistake.

My memory is that Nine Rings were made for Men, 7 Rings for the Dwarf Lords--this implies that these Rings were tuned to the recipients.

 

[Mormegil]

Originally posted by Harad

My memory is that Nine Rings were made for Men, 7 Rings for the Dwarf Lords--this implies that these Rings were tuned to the recipients.

Sorry Harad. Must Disagree.....

"Sauron gathered into his hands all the remaining Rings of Power; and he dealt them out to the other peoples of Middle-earth, hoping thus to bring under his sway all those that desired secret power beyond the measure of their kind. Seven rings he gave to the Dwarves; but to Men he gave nine , for Men proved in this matter as in others the readiest to his will." (Of The Rings Of Power, The Silmarillion)

This shows that the rings could have been used by any race. Sauron just chose to give 9 to Men and 7 to Dwarves. They weren't 'tuned' to a particular race of people.

 

[Harad]

Sauron gathered into his hands all the remaining Rings of Power

Is that conclusive? Maybe...The quote already seems odd to me since I dont understand the context. Why "remaining" and why did he have to gather them if he made them (with the Elf Master of course.)

 

[Grond]

There were, from the texts, 16 Great Rings that remained in Eregion. The Three were held by Galadriel (1) and Gil-galad (2). Galadriel had been ousted from Eregion by Celebrimbor and the other members of his Guild. When Sauron revealed himself by forging the One, Celebrimbor repented and left Galadriel her Ring in Lorien. He sent the other two to Gil-galad for safe keeping. He then returned to Eregion which was overrun by Sauron and Celebrimbor was captured. He was tortured and revealed in whose keeping the 16 were or where they were hidden (the text is unclear as to exactly where they were) and Sauron recovered all of these. Of the Three, Celebrimbor would not reveal their location and was cruelly put to death. His dead body was raised as a standard for Mordor's forces as they overran Eriador and bottled Gil-galad on the west side of the River Lune near the Grey Havens. It was at this time that the great host of Numenor caught Sauron unawares and came to Gil-galad's aid. A great host of ships landed at the Havens and an near equal host landed further South (near Bree or Weathertop is memory serves me well) and flanked Sauron's forces from the East. Almost all of Sauron's forces were annihilated in the ensuing battle and he barely escaped.

That is all from memory and may have some errors. It is told in detail in Unfinished Tales and one could venture there and get the story in the author's words and not my interpretation of the same.